WEBVTT

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MELHEM PODCAST

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MELHEM PODCAST

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GO!

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You must listen.

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You must listen.

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You must listen.

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Now, here is the Podcast Metal Heads Podcast.

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Hello, and welcome to the Metal Heads Podcast.

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My name is George.

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This is Jay.

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This is John.

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This is Matt.

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This is Markison.

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And if we're lucky, we might see Will in a little while.

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So let's hold on and see.

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Welcome to this latest episode. We're going to do things a little bit differently this time. We have an extra special guest for you today. However, the interview was recorded separately and I was not there for it. I haven't heard it yet. I haven't edited it yet. So we're going to put that at the end of the episode today. But spoiler, it's Hannes Grossman. I don't know how he managed to do it, but Markisan snagged us Hannes.

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And I just asked him. How did you do it? I just asked. Very direct. Yeah, well, you down. Yeah, I could do it. Well, you know, that doesn't usually work for me, but I'm not I don't have the magic of Markisan. So this is a lot of fun. So stick around and listen. Yeah. So we're going to we're going to forward to hearing it. I haven't heard a bit of it yet. Yeah. You better fucking ask some trip to con questions or I'm quitting the podcast. That's for sure.

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Indeed. Indeed. Indeed. So stick around to the end. If you're one of those people that listens to the first hour and you're like, ah, fuck it, I'm out of here. I think you might have reason to stick around this time. I don't know. I haven't heard it. Could fucking suck. Don't blame me if it does. Could be the best part of the episode. Could be. Nothing like getting the confidence of the podfather. Just saying, I haven't heard it yet. Last episode. So, yeah, stick around for that.

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I'm sorry to cut you off. Jay, I will say one thing. We actually didn't talk a ton, no spoiler, about any particular band a long time. We touched on a lot, but I think you'll be happy with the Trypticon. I had a list of questions about the Requiem because he's on the Requiem, and I really wanted to know what it was like for him to play that slow, as weird as it sounds, because that's almost more hard. I believe it's more harder. I had a ton more questions.

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We just didn't even get to because

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Honest, he really wanted to talk about

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things other than music because he's lived with it

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so long, his albums and everything like that.

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He really got into talking about television

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and movies and stuff.

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Well, you know what?

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And that's another side of them people don't see.

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So that's just a thing.

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Actually, he was more interested in talking about

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just the whole overall picture

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of making music, not the actual dance.

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I will leave it at that.

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Stick around.

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Excellent.

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Stick around.

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Now, just to make

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Marcason's friend Dan happy,

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We're only 12 minutes in or two minutes in or whatever. Yeah. Exactly. So count that three hour interview when. Yeah, exactly. That's at the end. So when Will shows up, he's going to be like, you already did T-shirt and beer check. Yeah. We'll might be wearing a very special T-shirt tonight, by the way. I made a shirt. I'm not a vest, but nothing underneath. I was hoping he's going to wear no shirt.

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at all. Tonight I'm wearing nipples. Nipples and hair. A little bit of electrical tape. Electrical tape. And axes. All right. Well, Markisan, start us off. I am wearing my Dephosphorus shirt. Yeah, but what band? I think the... Or alternately, George, what did you just say about my mother? Exactly. I think their album came out last year and was on my

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I'm not sure because everything blends together when you listen to so much metal. I am drinking the Golden Sabbath from Big Island Brew House. It is a Belgian style Abbey Ale with Hawaiian honey in it. Nice. I quite enjoy this one. I haven't seen it in a while. And then I came across a bunch. So I bought like five of them. Nice. It's very strong. I wish more breweries would venture into Belgian style.

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styles in the US. Right.

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Anytime I see the Belgian, I just grab it.

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That's sort of like an Icelandic, you know, Chilean band or something.

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And also, Sabbath is in the name.

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What was the name of it? I missed that.

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Golden Sabbath.

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Oh, nice.

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I guess I didn't miss it.

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Which is kind of what they are right now.

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They're kind of Golden Sabbath right now, aren't they?

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That's true.

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Golden years.

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All right, Matt.

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Okay, me.

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I have my Tripticon shirt on, and if anybody is watching at home, you will see me wearing that same shirt in the interview. I wanted to just maintain the continuity of my visual. That's my back patch for my battle vest. I took it off of that chart. Sorry. What Matt didn't tell you is he's been wearing it since the interview. You've all been wearing it at the same time since the interview. Exactly. That's real continuity. Bigger than my house.

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The same. So I wore the same shirt just so people, listeners couldn't tell that there was a break in what was going on. John, interesting note. I have a, I have a Belgian based brewery within, it's about a 25 minute bike ride from my house. I've been there a few times. It's wonderful. But tonight I'm drinking, it is called Old Breed by a brewery called Indeed. It is a bourbon barrel aged barley wine ale. I've been drinking a lot of these recently. And on the side, it says the secrets in the barrel. And I would agree. That's true. But I'm not going to share the secret.

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Yerk! Son of a bitch! I almost feel like that's like a Soylent Green moment or something, you know? Well, you know, I worked at KFC. I'm not going to tell you the secret recipe for that either. We are Soylent Green. That's exactly how Matt's shirt smells. I do smell like Soylent Green. And you are listening to the Metalheads podcast. And you can pry it from Michael Deadhead.

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Were you emulating somebody there? Charlton Heston. This is a horrible Heston. I gotta listen to that. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Then I was trying to merge into like Jack. Oh, because of the Soylent Green, of course. Yeah, yeah. Okay, I should have gone straight there. But you took a detour. Yeah. I mean, my impression isn't that great. So it's not that bad, though. What were you just doing there? That was me. Matt has a few drinks. Do the end of Planet of the Apes when he sees

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the Statue of Liberty. I forget what he says. He's like, you did it. You can't believe it. I can only remember from Spaceballs. All right, well, then just say Damn Dirty Apes. No, no, no. You should just say Damn Dirty J. Oh, Heston. Got it. The only, the liner I always remember is, from my cold, dead hands. Yeah. I always, by the way, my favorite joke for about a week after he died was, let's go get it. Yeah. But, you know, too soon, I'm sure. Even now. Yeah. All right, John. So,

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If you are watching at home, I'm like a performance artist. I'll be changing shirts throughout the episode tonight because I have a different shirt on during the interview. Matt, we do not have a Belgian brewery nearest, so you should consider yourself lucky. I am wearing... Thank you. Face warning, long day, good night. Which... Should be a long day, hard night. Something coming up here pretty soon. And I'm drinking Mile Zero. It's a West Coast IPA.

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from Front Royal Brewing and Front Royal, Virginia. Hmm. That's probably all I'm drinking tonight. I got an early morning tomorrow. Right. Jay, what are you wearing? What are you drinking your water out of? Or coffee? No, I'm drinking, I just, well, first of all, I made it, to pull this off, I made it home in record time. Yes, it is early for Jay. Well, I mean, I have. I mean, it's earlier for Markisan, but, you know, you had to come from work. I came from work eight at lightning speed, and then

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Now I'm having what I always have after dinner, which is blue bottle iced coffee. Delicious. Trust me. I am wearing my Slayer. This would be the final campaign tour shirt on the back. It says Oakland Arena, which would be there was two shows after that. And then there was no more Slayer. So this is the third to the last Slayer show. I try not to wear it too much and it still looks in pretty good shape because it does commemorate a pretty special show. Yeah, indeed. Nice. All right. I'm wearing my pig destroyer.

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Plague, like Plague Mask. I have to make a comment on that. I mean, do your beer first, but I have to make a comment on that big distraction. Sure, sure. Well, started with something I picked up while on vacation last week in Georgia from Jekyll Island Brewing. It's a hot dang diggity IPA. I do declare. This accent stolen from my cousin Vinny. Oh, I didn't catch that.

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Yeah, that was actually pretty good. It was sort of a lilting. The judge, Herman Munster guy, had kind of an accent like that. Your biological clock is ticking. From there, I moved on. I got it. Does that beer any good? Hey, she did get an Oscar. Let's be, you know. So I did my first ever beer exchange with a friend of mine in Texas.

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I sent him a shit ton of zombie dust and some Adroit theory. And he sent me like four different things, one of which is Stash IPA from, I think, Independence Brewing. What's the name of the brewery? Yeah, I've heard of them. Okay, good. It's got a... Cool. It's got like, you know... I feel like... Is that a Texas beer?

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It is. He sent me a bunch of Texas beer. I sent him zombie dust because he couldn't get it there. And, you know, I was going to send him some more local stuff. But how do I get on that mailing list? You know, zombie dust out here on the West Coast. Well, I guess you have to ask. So in an unrelated matter, George, could you send me some beer? So I did. My comment on your shirt was merely that I was swimming today, as I so often do.

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I was using my... Underwateraudio.com. Thank you. Void where prohibited. And I had thrown a head cage on there. And I haven't listened to it since probably last year. And the song, the last song came on. And I was like... I was just reminded how good that fucking record is. And also how heavy that... How fucking heavy, dude. Anyway, that was it. I just had a big destroyer experience today that really pleased me. And if the planets stay aligned, we'll see them in a little over a month.

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Not playing that, but. Yeah, so I'm going to go on a little pig destroyer rant. No, not rant. There you go. Thank you. But, you know, so synchronicity. Nicely done. Indeed. All right. So let's move on to the news.

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I would rather not because what the fuck has been going on this past month is there a fucking pandemic going on or something not that well actually one of one of them contributed to two of them as far as I'm concerned right so it's been a rough month these are not done in any order by the way to disrespect anybody no well it's more of order of the first order of what happened is what I'm going by so first off we had the death of Mike Howe

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The sometime singer of Metal Church, who replaced David Wayne. Active singer when he died. He was in abandoned. And I don't know the details other than they're saying that it was a suicide. Well, actually, I have a thought on that. I'll share what I read. Well, they said he hung himself. They did, but they said Metal Church put out a statement that said they felt he was failed by, bear with me here,

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the medical industry and the pharmaceutical industry. So I think that he got addicted to opioids or something. Right. That's what I'm guessing in that he just couldn't hack that. And he took the outdoor. And I think I feel like somebody I know did that as well. I don't know the exact details on that, although I know that was an issue and that's what he did. Wasn't it? It happened to Chris Cornell too? Well, he did.

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The doctors for the... Oh, yeah. Maybe. Yeah, maybe. Yeah. In fact, he had said that night he was taking... What was the one he was taking? I can't remember. I believe his wife said, you know, the doctors had failed him and the prescription he was taking, like, caused him to be out of his mind. Well, you know, a lot of these, as somebody that has a lot of prescriptions, not a lot, but a couple, or who just watches TV and gets bombarded by disclaimers from

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from drugs.

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A lot of things that you can take,

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they say,

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you know,

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might cause suicidal thoughts.

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Yeah.

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And,

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uh,

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I find it odd that Chris Cornell and Anthony Bourdain was right around that time too.

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And now Mike,

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how,

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but they all hanged themselves.

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I always find that.

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And Robin Williams choice.

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And Robin Williams.

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He,

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he had dementia though.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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But I don't have anything.

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How did Michael Hutchinson do it?

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Did he,

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he,

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his was a little

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Like auto-erotic, wasn't it? Yeah. I thought so. Yeah. And David Carradine. David Carradine. I don't know why I laugh, but it is funny what David Carradine does. I don't know. Well said. I will say one thing. I like Mike Kyle. I thought he was a great singer. So the last tour was Megadeth. This was a killer show. Megadeth, Metal Church, Monomarth, and Suicidal Tennessee. That was a fucking great tour. Yeah. And I had a good fortune to be my name.

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and he was such a nice guy. He was just a fucking, I mean, we say that so many times, but he was just this regular dude. It was just like, you know, happy to sit around and have a conversation, take a picture. Nice guy. Yeah. I don't know if you've gotten the latest decibel yet. I just got mine yesterday. The carcass cover? The carcass cover, yeah. Three issues ago? I don't know. I mean, I got like two issues in two weeks, so I don't know. I don't know where we are anymore. But Albert's, you know, little editorial at the beginning,

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talks about it and I thought it was really nice and he does have like the suicide hotline number at the end which I thought was pretty classy and cool and there's also one of the other guys I don't remember his name now which one it was but somebody also did an article on him so nice yeah he's only 55 did you see he lived and died in Eugene John Eugene or not Eugene no no Eureka Eureka excuse me yeah yeah I was surprised to hear that

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Yeah. There's a lot going on up there, unfortunately. Yeah. It's sad. I saw them at Prog Power, and he sounded amazing. When they were touring with, was it Saxon? Some people might know them by Saxon. But I think they did a tour together, and they added them to fill in on a Thursday night, and they were awesome. Maybe Saxon was with Armored Sand. I can't remember.

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But I saw them back in the day. I want to say it was the Blessing in Disguise tour, but it might have been Human Factor. Because I feel like I remember going out of that shirt's lame. I don't want that. Because, you know, I didn't like that cover. It was just kind of eh. But it was definitely one of his first two albums with Metal Church that I saw them back in the 80s, 90s.

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55.

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But, you know, if you think that's the last of the fucking horrible death things, think again. We got plenty more where that came from.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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So then the next day or possibly the same day, but not reported until the next day, Joey Jordison of Slipknot and various other things.

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Not a fan, but, you know, certainly a well-known dude.

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He died as well for reasons unknown.

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So far.

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Have they ever announced that?

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I mean, I know he had some physical issues, didn't he?

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He did.

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A friend of mine is a big fan.

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No, he had a, he had a multiple sclerosis.

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That's what it was.

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He lost the power in his legs, I think.

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Yeah.

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So that was his, that was his main aspect of his drumming was his, his footwork.

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Right.

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So it could be any number of complications.

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Yeah.

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And I'm not a fan either.

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And that's not like to be like a shit.

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It's just, but, but another guy,

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that everybody who spoke about him was like, nice fucking guy you ever met, man. So many nice tributes to him. So he must have been like a really good dude. Yeah. He's a pretty good player, too. I mean, that's what I, I mean, I never really listened to Slipknot or anything, but people keep saying what a great player he was and how influential he was. Yeah. For a lot of kids that are growing up. Yeah, definitely. Fan or not? He's only 46. That's my age. Yeah. Yeah. Fan or not, it sucks when somebody goes like that. Yeah.

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I'm sure not all of us can have a consensus that we're all fans of the names we're going to mention of the bands, but it doesn't matter. They're all part of that world. They're people, man. They're people. Yeah. And they're people, yeah, obviously. And then the day after that, because death didn't take a holiday. Because your nuts weren't already sore for getting kicked. Dusty Hill of ZZ Top passed away. Right.

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He was off the tour, wasn't he, at that point? Didn't he? Yeah. For like two days. Two days. Yeah. Yeah. He had left the tour. He took a break because he had a hip issue. Yeah. So I don't know if the death is related to that because it hasn't been said. I'm guessing he had a heart attack probably, but. He could have gotten an infection. Who knows? He could have been like, I'm off the tour. I might as well just drown myself in hookers and cocaine. You know, no. No, that's John Entwistle. Oh, right. He was on the tour. Yeah. But, well, I,

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I'll maybe take a charge on this one really quick because I'm a huge ZZ Top fan especially the early ZZ Top stuff I just love them and I would you know actually what I would say is I would recommend watching the Netflix ZZ Top thing if you haven't seen that yet the Sam Dunn yes the Sam Dunn thing he is such a charming and sweet individual and he talks about his love for Elvis and that which I love listening to and you can tell he's a fan apparently Elvis used to go to this restaurant where my mom worked in the 50s and and he's just like like this kid talking about

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And he was so obsessed with Elvis that he said he realized he might have a problem, as it were, when he had to have two dressing rooms, I think it was, that he'd show. One was for him and one was for all the Elvis stuff he brought on every tour, just to look at. And also by an exemplary singer and player. The guy had a voice like dynamite. And I would also, I put it on my Facebook page, but check out from the live album Fandango, the back,

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Backdoor Love Affair medley. Trust me, you will hear one of the most amazing things. It's like 14 minutes long. Yeah. And they do just scat. They'd scat through it, do all these really cool things. And it's just like, these guys are fucking balls out. And he's the coolest part on the whole thing. So. Yeah. Yeah. I listened to that the day after. It was really good. Yeah. That was a shocker. Yeah. So what we should have, instead of news, we should have called this in memoriam, you know, like they do on the Oscars and stuff. Next up. Oh, yeah. But we just spent more time.

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We spent more time on each person than the Oscars does. Oh, yeah. That's like next, next, next, next, next, next. Although I don't never, I haven't watched the Oscars. No, say the Grammys. Say the Grammys, too. Nobody watches us. The way they show a picture and they're gone in two seconds. Like, whoa. Yeah. So he was 72, by the way. Yeah, 72. So this next one, Eric Wagner, two days ago, you know, I put this on the script that Eric Wagner of trouble was in the hospital because,

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of COVID pneumonia.

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And then yesterday.

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Was it yesterday?

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It was announced, yeah.

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They were like, boom, dead.

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62?

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62.

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And COVID pneumonia.

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Can I just say that again?

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Unvaccinated COVID pneumonia.

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Go get your fucking shots, people.

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Hold on.

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Before you go any further with that, we have no idea why he wasn't vaccinated.

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Fair enough.

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But still. Yeah. Well, what if he couldn't get vaccinated? There's plenty of people. I know. I know. I know. Yeah. I know. Oh, the drummer, bass player, whatever. What was the band? I don't think it was a band I liked. Exodus, wasn't it? Who? Isn't it a drummer from Exodus? No, no. Somebody. Yes, you're right, though, Jack. Yes, that's just. I know you're talking. I can't think of it. No, there was some musician. It was a drummer, bass player, something like that.

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for a band. I don't think it was a band I liked, but I saw the article on it. And he has a condition and his doctor advised him not to get the vaccine because of his existing condition. And so he didn't. And the band booted him from there. They booted him, period. Yeah, I saw that. Who was that? Go ahead. I can't remember. I mean, it was somebody I've heard of, but.

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Yeah, I feel like it was like a pop-punk band, you know, like a Green Day kind of band or something. It wasn't Green Day, but you know. We don't know the circumstances of it, but I mean, you should get vaccinated. If you're going to die because you just choose not to get vaccinated, it's hard to have sympathy for me. Die with your boots on, motherfuckers. Yeah, I guess. I mean, if there's a reason. Yeah, I just think that it's irresponsible.

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for anyone to comment that doesn't know.

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No, fair enough.

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Yeah.

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And I obviously there are people that have issues.

00:23:55.940 --> 00:24:00.660
I just don't think it's for any of us to either criticize or support.

00:24:00.920 --> 00:24:01.620
We just don't know.

00:24:02.220 --> 00:24:02.320
Right.

00:24:03.020 --> 00:24:09.060
But if you're like, I'm not getting it because I mean, I've got a friend that I've been fighting with and he's going to hear this at some point.

00:24:09.240 --> 00:24:10.680
So motherfucker, get your shot.

00:24:12.060 --> 00:24:12.880
And I'll see him this weekend.

00:24:13.020 --> 00:24:14.020
So he won't know I said this.

00:24:16.660 --> 00:24:44.020
But if you're doing it because you think there's tracking things in there or because it's a conspiracy, you need to shut the fuck up and get the shot. If you have a condition that prevents you from getting it, fine. I'm going to stop you there because I'm not defending anyone. But I hear everyone say it's because they're either conspiracy theorists or crazy white ringers. And that's just not the fact. I didn't say that they are. I said if you are. It's always what I hear people say. And I feel like we're now tearing each other apart.

00:24:44.820 --> 00:25:13.880
We definitely are. We don't know what's going on. And trust me, I mean, I got mine as soon as I could. As soon as the fucking county allowed me to. You know? Actually, just to back that up a little bit, I will say this. You'd be surprised. And I'm not joking how many people in Berkeley won't get it. Oh, I know. That's as far left as you can go. So, you know. It's the same in D.C. Does it have granola in it? No. Not kidding. Same in D.C. That's why I bring that up. That's not far off, George. It's not. It is like a question about. Is it vegan? By the way,

00:25:14.100 --> 00:25:44.060
Is it a vegan shot? Is that what you just said? I looked it up and... Thank you for the love of you there, George. You're welcome. Really worth mentioning, but the guy that got kicked out of the band was kicked out of Offspring. Oh, yeah, that's what it was. Okay, well, I like them. I don't like them lately, but I like the earlier stuff. Yeah, it's just, it's such a crazy subject now to talk about because there's so many swirling things going around in the big pit and then it's just confusing. So I'm not trying to fight you guys, but I just...

00:25:44.080 --> 00:26:13.920
I'm so tired of my neighbors on next door fighting with each other. It's like, dude, I wanted to see whose dog shit on my lawn. And there's a picture out there. And here I am hearing people fighting. No, I would just say, I mean, I don't, we don't know the circumstances of why I didn't get the vaccine, but I love trouble. And we also did, uh, uh, I think one of the, um, Thunderdome's had trouble on it. That's right. And, uh, I was fortunate enough to see trouble play when I was in Chicago.

00:26:14.080 --> 00:26:43.960
And they just were amazing. That was the highlight of the show. And that's not why I went to that particular show. So a big loss, I think, because they were like one of those real first doom bands, like, you know, a Candlemas in that period. And still really love that stuff, especially like the remastered version of their album. So sad. Yeah, definitely. Also, by the way, just to,

00:26:44.080 --> 00:27:14.060
make sure we don't disrespect him he wasn't just the singer of trouble he had a band called the skull too so that's just worth mentioning that he you know he in his own right he went out and did more and it was really good i didn't realize that he had left trouble because he didn't want to tour anymore i read something he was just not enjoying touring and he started to stall and they started touring and i was like i just think he probably was in a strange place you know i'm sure all musicians get there at some point in their careers yeah and

00:27:14.080 --> 00:27:43.560
Maybe you get reinvigorated by the new band, you know, John, and you're like, all right, I'm going to do this again. I think you're right. Yeah. So it sucks, to be honest with you, because if I'm a big trouble fan, too, especially the first three albums, because after the first three, they become more of a stoner band. But it's funny. They can get credit for being one of the I don't consider Sabbath or like pentagram to be true doom bands. They started doom, but they're not part of the doom wave.

00:27:44.419 --> 00:28:13.540
I would say Trouble was like the first real Doom band. Yeah, then Witchfinder Generals won. Okay, fair enough. I have to add something then real quick, Jen, and I'm so sorry because it's completely off subject, and it's that this is, to me, that's the exact thing that I feel about the whole Possessed death. I do. No, I think Possessed created death metal, but they weren't really a death metal band. So I said it. I just wanted to throw that out there.

00:28:13.580 --> 00:28:43.340
But yes, they're definitely one of the forefathers of it. And I'm sure they'll get mentioned again. It's a legend. I mean, that's the thing. And that's always tough. You know, when somebody is part of something, like starting something that we love, that's come so far. You know, it's worth mentioning too, and this is true for both Candlemas and for Trouble, that that was the early Metal Blade era, the combat era,

00:28:43.420 --> 00:29:12.300
All those things were starting to have an Elson Underground thing. And everything was thrashed. So those two bands actually really stood out as not doing what was cool at the moment at all. I mean, a lot of people liked it. I'm not saying that. It's just like that was a brave and weird move in the middle. All of the speed wars that were 82 to 88 or whatever, you know. It was Trouble. And real quick about Trouble, they get credit for helping start the traditional Doom, but they also get credit for being one of the first stoner metal bands.

00:29:13.400 --> 00:29:43.020
Because they, on the third album, it starts seeping in a little bit. And then the fourth album, which is just called Trouble, which forced them to rename the first album, which was called Trouble to Psalm 9, they start to become a stoner band. They're not, I don't think they're the original, but they're one of the early ones. I mean, they're just integral into the history of metal. And Eric Wagner is a huge part of that. Yeah. Typical of a stoner band to forget that they named their first album Trouble. And they're like, let's call it Trouble, man.

00:29:44.900 --> 00:30:13.380
Oh, wait, wait, what was the first album again? I wouldn't doubt for one second if that wasn't a label thing to that. They had some very strange label things with metal blade and whatever. It's a loss. He's not the only one. Speaking of legends, just today, Charlie Watts of the Rolling Stones passed away at 80 years old. And I was in the middle of a meeting when I

00:30:13.420 --> 00:30:43.380
I think it was Jay that dropped that bomb. I was like, what the fuck? Yeah, it was so unexpected. Yeah, well, so I did do some follow-up, and I'm sure you guys did too by now. Apparently he'd had heart surgery fairly recently and was quote-unquote recovering from that. The Rick Ocasek, you call it the Rick Ocasek. Yeah, he apparently was, by all accounts, was doing really well, and then... Wasn't. Wasn't, yeah. Well, I liked Rolling Stones, and I have a shame in saying that, and Charlie was such a weird...

00:30:43.420 --> 00:31:12.660
He's like the original Bunny Carlos. Just so out of fucking place. You know what I mean? He's the gentleman of the Rolling Stones. Yeah. Well, somebody posted it. I want to say it was Joan Baez. He said he was a gentleman among thieves. Yeah, that works. Yeah. He was a straightforward dude. I wanted to read this to you guys real quick. I found a quote.

00:31:14.159 --> 00:31:42.700
because apparently he dabbled in heroin in the 70s, which doesn't surprise me. He's in the Rolling Stones. Who didn't? Apparently. Go ahead. I said, who in the Stones didn't in the 70s? Yeah. Well, this is, that's what I'm getting to here. So apparently he, he said, I was very fortunate never to get hooked on it. He said, but I, I did try it for a while. And he said, this is, I'm quoting from him. I fell asleep on the floor during the recording of some girls and Keith, otherwise known as Keith.

00:31:43.520 --> 00:32:12.940
woke me up and said, you should do this when you're older. And then it says, Keith telling me this was the exclamation point. And I found that so funny because here's Keith Richards telling him not to do drugs. But here's the part of the quote that I thought was even funnier. He said, but it stuck. And I stopped everything at that point. Wow. Imagine that Keith Richards being a good influence on somebody. Well, I wouldn't doubt if he took his heroin then after that.

00:32:14.080 --> 00:32:41.980
He's like, I'm out, man. You caught anything you're not using. But if Keith is telling you to knock it off, he'd come out. You'd think that Keith would be a deterrent. You'd just see what that guy did on a daily basis. You're like, no way I'm going down that path. I'm telling you right now, Keith should be the first person on the first manned mission to any planet that we land on that goes on without a helmet because there's nothing that's going to ruin that guy's body. He's going to kill every disease on that planet.

00:32:42.020 --> 00:33:11.820
Well, that's the crazy thing about these deaths. You never know when you're going to go. It doesn't matter if you're like the healthiest person on the planet or you've abused drugs since you were like tiny. You know, Tracy's mentor just collapsed dead of a heart attack. He was in pretty good shape, only 60. And he was out for a run and just collapsed and died. And yet we still have Ozzie. Unexpected. Exactly. So some of these guys, it's amazing that they've made it this far.

00:33:14.660 --> 00:33:42.000
I read a story it wasn't a brief anecdote just the other day and I want to believe it's true and I think it probably is because it was presented in such a way that it didn't look like somebody was telling a joke and it was just that the it was a story from Keith Richards and Keith Richards said they were in the hotel this is like the brief briefest version of it they're in the hotel and somebody shouted there was a knock at the door and somebody shouted it's the police and so they like

00:33:42.020 --> 00:33:43.920
around and flushed everything down the toilet and everything.

00:33:44.420 --> 00:33:44.640
And then,

00:33:44.980 --> 00:33:46.680
but it was Stuart Copeland and staying.

00:33:47.840 --> 00:33:48.960
I was just thinking that.

00:33:50.140 --> 00:33:50.860
I've heard that before,

00:33:51.160 --> 00:33:51.240
Jay.

00:33:51.540 --> 00:33:51.880
I've heard that.

00:33:51.880 --> 00:33:52.980
I think it's a real story.

00:33:53.130 --> 00:33:54.920
I think that's that actually happened.

00:33:55.030 --> 00:33:55.160
Yeah.

00:33:55.580 --> 00:33:55.760
Oh,

00:33:55.800 --> 00:33:56.340
here comes our,

00:33:57.180 --> 00:33:58.620
here comes beefcake.

00:33:58.870 --> 00:33:58.980
Well,

00:34:01.040 --> 00:34:01.860
there he is.

00:34:02.670 --> 00:34:02.780
Oh,

00:34:02.980 --> 00:34:03.900
speaking of beefcakes,

00:34:04.700 --> 00:34:05.220
look at that shirt.

00:34:06.080 --> 00:34:07.040
Stay on target.

00:34:07.480 --> 00:34:08.379
Stay on target.

00:34:08.740 --> 00:34:09.720
Stay on target.

00:34:13.099 --> 00:34:39.340
I got this shirt in the mail yesterday and it was addressed to Will Beefcake. Ah. Yes. I saw that, Will, and I thought of you. Plus, you're such a perfect male specimen. I just kind of want to dress you up, buddy. Yeah, did you know that he's donating his member to the Icelandic Penis Museum? I did. I saw that. They're going to have to put in a whole new wing. You're such a specimen. I wanted to give you a shirt with a guy named Porkins on him.

00:34:41.000 --> 00:35:10.640
Actually, Jay, it's not a new wing, it's a new leg. There was a backhanded tongue-in-cheek motive operandi to getting me this shirt. No, honestly, I was just like, I saw it, I was like, he'll get a kick out of this. Out of all of us, you're like the Star Wars guy, and I know we are all the Star Wars guy, but you're the fucking Star Wars guy, and I was like, it's just perfect. The Looch, who's been on the podcast before, a friend of ours, who will be at Decibel, hopefully, in Philly, him and I used to play Star Wars Trivia Pursuit whenever we got together, and I won.

00:35:10.780 --> 00:35:40.760
I would run the table and at the very end Luch would catch up and win Star Wars Trivia Pursuit. And the one time I won, the answer was Porkins. So when I saw that shirt, that's the first thing I thought of besides my physique. Well, it's a gift of love, sir. It is. No, I appreciate it. I love it. So, Will, we were just finishing up

00:35:40.800 --> 00:36:10.500
Our In Memoriam section of the podcast. Oh my god. People dying every fucking day. Exactly. So I want to I want to raise my glass to all of those people that we just lost. And we did lose one more. Oh, right, right. Sorry. Metalheads. It's okay. Don Everly from the Everly Brothers, who most people may not know who they are, know the songs, but they had some massive. Isn't that the ghost song? Bye Bye.

00:36:10.800 --> 00:36:40.600
Love. No, that's the Righteous Brothers. Righteous Brothers. I knew they were some brothers. Wake Up Little Susie. I mean, everyone's heard that song at some point in their life. But anyway, they influenced a lot of musicians that we like. And so it's like, fuck. Okay. Now I raise my glass. Yeah. It's just a lot of people in a short span of time. Yeah. I'm sure you guys talked about Eric Wagner of Skull and Trouble. Yeah. We did. Yeah. I'll tell this quick story and I won't bore anybody with it too much, but it was,

00:36:41.560 --> 00:37:10.740
I was definitely torn because it was a night that the Eagles were in the Super Bowl. And I guess it was February 2017-18. And that same night, so I'm a Philadelphia Philly Eagles Flyers don't care about the Sixers much, but Eagles are finally in the Super Bowl. They won the Super Bowl, but that night the skull, i.e. the trouble was playing at Atlas. So as soon as the game was over, because I promised my

00:37:10.780 --> 00:37:40.740
I'll watch a game with them I bolted probably speeding to Atlas to catch most of the skull set and they played Psalm 9 that night like they were playing that album and and so I caught most of the set because the trouble waited until the game was over to go on so I only missed like 10 minutes of it and I just remember hanging out afterwards

00:37:40.780 --> 00:38:10.020
with Eric and he's sitting there smoking a cigarette in the brewery. I'm kind of like, do I, do I tell him like, look, dude, this is a production facility. You can't smoke in here. Is that code that when you said cigarette? No, no, it was actually a cigarette. It was like chain smoking cigarettes back there. And I was just like, dude, like, come on, man. He's doing it right by all the, like the barrel aging stuff. I sat down and had a, I wouldn't say a nice conversation with him because he didn't really seem that interested in talking to me.

00:38:11.260 --> 00:38:40.740
But eventually I said like, hey man, once you're done with that, don't let up another one because you can't smoke in here. It's a production facility. Did you walk over to the equipment and add to the tag smoked? Smoked? Yeah. That was the smoke barrel. But that was such a great show and his voice still sounded great. Sure. That's a bummer, man. I remember that. I didn't go. I was going to just add on to John's

00:38:40.780 --> 00:39:07.840
Or Will's John's Everly Brothers thing. They are a larger underpinning influence to a lot of what we listen to today than you might guess. And one thing I learned, I didn't realize this, they wrote that Linda Ronstadt hit, I've been lied to and mistreated, you know, when will I find true love, whatever. They wrote some fucking shit, dude. You just lost everybody on that one. Even me. Everly Brothers, they wrote some shit.

00:39:11.440 --> 00:39:17.380
Keith loved them and the Beatles loved them and Neil Young and it just

00:39:18.520 --> 00:39:25.760
I'm going to bring it that bringing him up is just that it was another person and a long line from this past month yeah you know so

00:39:26.280 --> 00:39:36.860
weird shitty month man what the hell you let's move on then so our next item the new Iron Maiden singles of which there are two

00:39:38.820 --> 00:40:05.900
The Writing on the Wall and just released a couple days ago. I think it was last week. Stratego. One of my favorite childhood games. Both of these songs are from their forthcoming new album Senjutsu, which is out on September 3rd, which is not too far. It's like next week, I think. Actually next Friday, is it? Yes.

00:40:06.220 --> 00:40:32.240
I mean like not this week, but next week. So I I've listened to the writing on the wall several times. I wasn't sure what to think the first time, but it grew on me with multiple listens. Unfortunately, I've only listened to Stratego once and I was only half paying attention. So I really don't have much to say about that one. It sounds like one of the deeper tracks from.

00:40:36.240 --> 00:40:40.580
to it. It's not as good as writing on the wall, I don't think, personally.

00:40:40.860 --> 00:40:41.140
Okay.

00:40:42.860 --> 00:40:46.620
I mean, writing on the wall is a really good track. Plus, it's got that video, which is amazing.

00:40:46.920 --> 00:40:47.900
That is a great video.

00:40:48.260 --> 00:40:58.520
I like Stratego a lot. I feel like both the songs have that Brave New World feel to me, and that's my all-time favorite made now. So I'm pretty pumped to hear the rest of the record.

00:40:59.520 --> 00:41:00.060
It's going to be a long one.

00:41:01.200 --> 00:41:01.300
Yeah.

00:41:02.580 --> 00:41:03.980
Put aside some time.

00:41:04.380 --> 00:41:33.480
Will aside, it was funny because I, not funny, I thought that video was amazing. But the entire time I was watching that video, and I liked the song too, the song was pretty good. I liked the video more than the song. But I thought this video does not match the song. Like the video is way more intense than the song is. It's almost like this easygoing, you know, kind of Western feel song. But the video was like super intense, like the super sci-fi thing. Heavy metal. Yeah, and I was kind of like,

00:41:34.400 --> 00:42:04.000
I like them both, but they don't go together. It's very entirely possibly reached out to that production facility and just said, make us a six minute video and didn't let them hear the song well. I think when they're doing that video, they haven't done a video like that in a long time. And, you know, definitely not an animated video. So you want to put everything you can into it. So I think they just went a little crazy with it. What's the last one they did? Didn't they do one for a sci-fi one? It was from the,

00:42:04.060 --> 00:42:33.980
It was off a dance of death. The opening track. They did an animated video. They did one after that too. It was the weird one with the space alien eddy on the cover. Final Frontier. There's a video for that. That's animated. I love writing on the wall. That song sticks in my head. I can play that thing over and over and over again. And I like that. That's what I like. I don't want to say sing-songy, but you know, the more of the anthemic maiden songs. That's what it really reminds me of.

00:42:34.100 --> 00:43:04.040
I can sing almost all those songs by heart. And how cool were all those Eddies on motorcycles? You've got, you know, Power Slave Eddie and Somewhere in Time Eddie and Classic Eddie and, you know, that was fucking cool. I think what's cool too is that like a new Maiden song that we haven't heard from them in a few years, a new Maiden song brings everybody out of the woodwork. Like people that I haven't talked to in, well, a while, especially with COVID, they're like, oh dude, new Maiden, like just emails and texts out of nowhere. You know, it kind of brings

00:43:04.080 --> 00:43:33.980
Not that we don't have the camaraderie with each other, but it kind of just reaches out a little bit further. Smile. I can't wait to get the vinyl. I'm excited. Hopefully it comes on the day it drops. Hopefully it comes on the day it drops. When was it, George? September 3rd. Oh, God, that's right around the corner. It is. In fact, it'll probably be out by the time this posts. So, yeah. By the time we're finished recording.

00:43:34.080 --> 00:43:34.960
Yeah, yeah.

00:43:37.240 --> 00:43:38.600
Stay on target.

00:43:39.040 --> 00:43:42.540
They're not the only ones to release a song.

00:43:43.520 --> 00:43:45.180
Exodus also released a new song.

00:43:45.250 --> 00:43:47.420
The beatings will continue until morale improves,

00:43:47.590 --> 00:43:50.960
which is also a t-shirt that I got my father for Father's Day one year.

00:43:51.980 --> 00:43:53.400
And he wears it continually.

00:43:55.300 --> 00:43:58.180
This is another one that I listened to half-assed once.

00:43:59.720 --> 00:44:00.280
I love it.

00:44:00.350 --> 00:44:02.260
I definitely dug the beginning of it.

00:44:02.600 --> 00:44:32.480
George. Huh? Would you say to prepare for the cast? I mean, I was on vacation. I didn't have access to things and I I'm back for vacation two days and I'm buried in work. What can I say? Um, I tried excited for this record, dude. I think the last two central records are fucking bombs. I mean like nuclear bombs. And so I can't wait for this one. This I'm like, I mentioned this to you guys. I'm excited for this as anything this year. I expect this to be a fucking super fun, super great jazzed up, spiced up record.

00:44:33.979 --> 00:44:35.340
I remember when Tom

00:44:35.800 --> 00:44:35.860
or

00:44:38.000 --> 00:44:38.440
what's his name?

00:44:38.860 --> 00:44:38.960
Hunting?

00:44:40.079 --> 00:44:41.280
No, when Gary Holt shared.

00:44:41.390 --> 00:44:43.980
Do you remember a few months back when he shared the notes about the record?

00:44:44.150 --> 00:44:44.340
Yeah, yeah.

00:44:44.460 --> 00:44:46.120
All these little personalized things next to him.

00:44:46.520 --> 00:44:48.780
I could feel his excitement and I think it's a great song.

00:44:49.120 --> 00:44:53.820
So it fits right in with what they've done in Tempo of the Damned and Blood and Blood Out,

00:44:54.080 --> 00:44:56.660
both records which I still listen to fairly regularly.

00:44:57.140 --> 00:44:58.540
So yeah, I'm psyched.

00:44:58.810 --> 00:45:00.940
And by the way, and speaking of Tom though,

00:45:02.040 --> 00:45:32.020
You know, in case you live in a fucking cave and haven't heard, he did survive his surgery that we were talking about, like, I think it was the last time. And he's still with us, so at least he's not on that fucking list. And they did play a show with his blessing with a different drummer two nights ago or something. Was that Joey Tempesta? Yeah. Was it? Okay. Yeah, he's playing with them again. Was it Joey Jordanson? Not him, for sure. But it was...

00:45:32.060 --> 00:46:01.580
I actually saw some footage from it because like I'm friends with Zetro's kids on Facebook for some reason and they were live streaming it. Wait, what? They're, well, they have their own band and I think I got friended up with them that way. They're that hatred thing, right? Yeah, hatred. That's Zetro's kids. Yeah, that's when I had an opportunity to interview him and turned it down. Oh, that's right. I forgot. You turned it down? Zetro's publicist wrote to me and said, Steve would like to do an interview with you and I didn't respond.

00:46:02.519 --> 00:46:31.860
Oh boy. Cause I was like, I was like, uh, this was like, I mean, this was probably even before the podcast. This was probably back when I was just doing like reviews and stuff. And, uh, I wrote a review of it and he liked it. So he wanted to do an interview and I was like, uh, I don't know how to do interviews. He's a, by the way, he has, are you saying you do now? No, not at all. But there's more of us strength in numbers. He's got a pretty cool podcast.

00:46:32.040 --> 00:47:01.180
And I don't know if you guys saw recently too, but he lost a bunch of weight, dude. He did. COVID to like loosely like 60 pounds or some crazy thing. I did some of that too, just not as much. Maybe you went on my show alone. You're wasting away, George. Well, the Exodus song is pretty good. I like the riff on it. I mean, I don't really care for Exodus that much, but bite your tongue, sir. Bite your tongue. I did. I don't like the vocals. I don't think I ever need gang vocals in anything.

00:47:01.740 --> 00:47:03.420
You are not bonded by blood

00:47:05.200 --> 00:47:06.620
They don't do it that much though

00:47:07.020 --> 00:47:07.540
That's probably

00:47:08.160 --> 00:47:08.740
They probably don't

00:47:09.819 --> 00:47:11.420
Will did you see the album cover?

00:47:12.260 --> 00:47:12.600
Excuse me

00:47:12.640 --> 00:47:13.660
The album cover does look cool

00:47:13.730 --> 00:47:14.240
Because I saw

00:47:14.819 --> 00:47:15.660
Decibel blasted out

00:47:15.750 --> 00:47:17.260
Like 1500 different ways

00:47:17.700 --> 00:47:18.280
Didn't it also

00:47:18.520 --> 00:47:20.360
Did it kind of have a creator feel to it?

00:47:20.520 --> 00:47:20.740
Yeah

00:47:20.780 --> 00:47:21.520
Did you think that cover?

00:47:21.800 --> 00:47:21.900
Yeah

00:47:22.180 --> 00:47:22.920
Like modern creator

00:47:22.990 --> 00:47:24.380
But it's also a kickass looking cover

00:47:25.000 --> 00:47:26.120
I have not heard the song

00:47:27.400 --> 00:47:28.540
And I think at this point

00:47:28.700 --> 00:47:29.340
Because it's coming out

00:47:29.370 --> 00:47:30.879
In like a week and a half

00:47:30.880 --> 00:48:00.860
I may just go dark on it and just wait till it comes out. This is one of those weird things like I'm pretty sure I pre-ordered it on vinyl somewhere somehow. This is one of those drunk camping things like and I saw and I saw the decibel thing like oh you know order the box and I'm like oh I think I ordered that already. I don't know and I literally went I think this was literally last night I went through my email and like you know you categorize things and I went to that folder that like when I shop or I

00:48:00.880 --> 00:48:30.860
buy something and I'm like I don't see oh my god you're gonna get three albums I know you should I make a list I use Evernote and I make a list of all the things that I actually buy so and then I put the tracking numbers on there whenever I get them so pretty well you're very anal retentive aren't you that's no I'm just awesome sometimes a nice surprise like when when the Dio comic book and the vinyl shows up and you're like oh yeah I ordered this like a year ago the fucking Dio comic

00:48:30.880 --> 00:49:00.600
was great. I didn't read the whole thing because I stopped halfway through. I'm like, what the hell does this have to do with Holy Diver? And then I realized. You gotta read to the end, Will. Jesus. I guess so, but I kind of thought it was more like the Anthrax thing, which I ordered and forgot about, and then that showed up. Oh, is that cool? Yeah, it's pretty cool. But that's more on point with the songs and stuff. Stay on target. Well, the Anthrax was that each illustrator did a version of the song. Right, right. And that's kind of what I was expecting with the.

00:49:00.900 --> 00:49:30.860
They were short. They were like, you know, six pages, four pages or whatever. Short. Like an entire graphic novel based on the album. And they give you a lot of backstory that's not in the song. Well, there's only like 40 words in that song. So there's a lot of liberties. But yeah, I would read it because I think you'll be satisfied with the ending. Yeah, I'm not saying I'm dissatisfied. I was just expecting more of like, okay, first song, we rock and there's going to be something

00:49:30.880 --> 00:49:33.260
some comic, short comic about that.

00:49:33.320 --> 00:49:35.480
And then, you know, so on and so forth.

00:49:35.580 --> 00:49:36.960
Go back to it and stay on target.

00:49:37.580 --> 00:49:38.360
You'll get a happy ending.

00:49:39.080 --> 00:49:39.680
All right, yeah.

00:49:40.720 --> 00:49:43.100
Speaking of which, when I was on vacation,

00:49:43.700 --> 00:49:47.540
whenever, two weeks ago, I did finish in the Dio book.

00:49:47.840 --> 00:49:49.320
Which is what we're talking about next.

00:49:49.720 --> 00:49:50.200
Oh, okay.

00:49:50.340 --> 00:49:52.100
And then the Rob Halford book, I finished both of them.

00:49:52.180 --> 00:49:52.280
Nice.

00:49:52.500 --> 00:49:52.940
All right, nice.

00:49:53.760 --> 00:49:55.080
Speaking of happy endings.

00:49:55.520 --> 00:49:57.180
Speaking of Ronnie James Dio books,

00:49:57.740 --> 00:49:59.500
his autobiography, Rainbow in the Dark,

00:49:59.620 --> 00:50:00.540
was released recently.

00:50:00.600 --> 00:50:30.580
And I think just about everybody in the world read that or at least everybody on this podcast or like most everybody on this podcast. I read it and finished it. Thought it was wonderful. Was sad that it ended with Sacred Heart, but at least he got Sacred Heart in there because that's my favorite to you album. It's also it's arguably his success apex, you know, was I didn't know that I thought it was I always thought it was kind of a bomb because nobody really liked it. You know, everybody liked the first two albums so much more, but but it was

00:50:30.620 --> 00:50:59.820
more successful than the other two, which blows my mind. Well, more to the point, though, he also did his biggest tour for that record. That's the big Drago Orr thing. Yeah, and there's also, you know, go back to whatever this was. This was like the late 80s. 1986. Yeah. So you couldn't preview albums. There was no Spotify. So you just, if you like the first two DO albums, you're like, yes, I'm buying this. And like, ah, you know, maybe it's not as good as the first two.

00:51:00.240 --> 00:51:05.160
But you bought it because the first one I bought

00:51:07.620 --> 00:51:09.560
I saw Holy Diver I was like damn

00:51:09.980 --> 00:51:11.500
You know this is of course on cassette

00:51:12.620 --> 00:51:14.720
In like an actual record store in the mall

00:51:14.840 --> 00:51:16.900
I'm like ooh Holy Diver that looks motherfucking cool

00:51:17.440 --> 00:51:18.780
But I was like wait this one just came out

00:51:18.880 --> 00:51:20.220
Like last week I'm gonna get this one

00:51:22.380 --> 00:51:23.580
Did you talk like that?

00:51:24.060 --> 00:51:24.320
I did

00:51:24.480 --> 00:51:26.019
Adam Sandler when you were a kid

00:51:31.980 --> 00:51:55.200
Adam Sandler's got two modes, angry and baby talk. I hate that guy so much. I love Adam Sandler. Oh, God. Well, I agree with you, George. It feels like an unfinished symphony, if you will, since he literally just stopped writing at some point and didn't get a chance to really, and he wrote it many years. He had been writing it for years, so that's just as far as he made it.

00:51:56.020 --> 00:52:25.980
Did you notice the part? I was going to say the last bit, and that was just that I bet we're all happy that Mick Wall was involved in finishing it. I think he did a great job. Anyway, go ahead, George. At some point in there, he said, and we were friends for the rest of our lives, or something to that effect. It was like he knew either he knew that he was dying and he wasn't going to make it like, you know, it was just a weird turn of phrase, the way he was.

00:52:26.040 --> 00:52:54.940
said something. Who was he talking about? Richie? No. He definitely wasn't. No. The stuff about Richie in there was great. Yeah, that was. And he was very fair to everybody. To both Richie and Tommy. Tommy, Tony. Some of the stuff that stuck out to me was like the Vivian Campbell stuff. And then when it got into Dio years where he's like, hey, look, I'm Dio and you guys were nobody's.

00:52:56.020 --> 00:52:57.100
Like you were a nobody

00:52:57.720 --> 00:52:58.120
And I brought you

00:52:58.190 --> 00:52:59.120
And I paid you well

00:52:59.860 --> 00:53:01.120
And I think there was like

00:53:01.120 --> 00:53:01.620
A little bit of

00:53:02.190 --> 00:53:02.600
Over promise

00:53:02.830 --> 00:53:04.280
Under deliver on Dio's part

00:53:04.760 --> 00:53:04.860
Yeah

00:53:05.539 --> 00:53:06.800
If I had a guess

00:53:06.980 --> 00:53:08.020
And he's sort of like

00:53:08.180 --> 00:53:08.960
Yeah you know

00:53:09.110 --> 00:53:09.740
You were a nobody

00:53:10.080 --> 00:53:11.180
I paid you really well

00:53:11.280 --> 00:53:12.260
Now you're super famous

00:53:12.799 --> 00:53:13.520
And you know

00:53:13.800 --> 00:53:14.640
You have a Ferrari

00:53:15.580 --> 00:53:15.800
Yeah

00:53:16.570 --> 00:53:17.280
Shut the fuck up

00:53:17.640 --> 00:53:18.760
And say thanks

00:53:19.160 --> 00:53:19.820
And he's fine

00:53:19.900 --> 00:53:20.560
He's in Def Leppard

00:53:20.660 --> 00:53:21.300
Now he's got a lot of money

00:53:21.360 --> 00:53:22.080
But Vivian Campbell

00:53:22.260 --> 00:53:23.280
The way he tells it

00:53:23.340 --> 00:53:24.200
And I kind of believe it

00:53:24.520 --> 00:53:25.319
And I know he's changed

00:53:27.300 --> 00:53:55.180
He says that they all made the agreement or Dio said, look, let's get three records in and then I'll make you whole. We'll be a big part of this thing. And then Vivian said he always believed that it was Wendy that kept that from happening. So he said he never really had any animosity for Dio after the initial animosity. And I think Dio in the book kind of hints at that, that Wendy was the driving force. She was the manager at the time. Wendy even says so.

00:53:55.320 --> 00:54:23.820
She's like, yeah, it was me. Yeah, yeah. Like, yeah, I think it comes out in the book that, you know, both sides are kind of right. Like, you know, hey, you did well, Vivian. Like, we did well by you, but if you wanted more than, you know, we kind of fucked you too. Yeah, fair enough. Yeah. And again, like I said, it all turned out fine for him, so fuck whatever. Yeah. You know, he's got Def Leppard money now. That's more money than D.O. ever had, so whatever. Yeah.

00:54:25.320 --> 00:54:52.200
All right. You know, in a weird sort of way, because Rob Halford literally goes all the way up to the last record, because it's just released. He even talks about COVID. Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's so relevant and recent.

00:54:56.660 --> 00:55:25.300
I'm trying to think like I and it had the glory hole artist yeah there was some it actually doesn't you know I have to say like so I finished a book and then there's a there's a guy my actually my one of my bosses at work loves Judas Priest but it's pretty like Christian conservative and I said you know I just finished reading the book and he's like oh yeah I'm being to pick that up I'm like you know

00:55:25.300 --> 00:55:26.340
Maybe high pass.

00:55:28.220 --> 00:55:29.140
A lot of detail.

00:55:29.800 --> 00:55:32.360
And I said, like, you know, there's a lot of stuff in there.

00:55:32.480 --> 00:55:33.520
And he's like, yeah, yeah, I want to read it.

00:55:33.580 --> 00:55:33.880
I'm like, okay.

00:55:34.060 --> 00:55:35.180
And I literally gave it to him today.

00:55:37.480 --> 00:55:37.720
Yeah.

00:55:39.160 --> 00:55:39.500
I don't know.

00:55:39.580 --> 00:55:43.420
I think I'm slightly more fascinated by Dio in some ways.

00:55:43.960 --> 00:55:44.120
Sure.

00:55:45.180 --> 00:55:46.940
But, I mean, I love them both.

00:55:49.000 --> 00:55:50.340
It's kind of, you know, it's a toss-up.

00:55:50.420 --> 00:55:50.500
Yeah.

00:55:50.800 --> 00:55:57.520
I mean, actually, one of the things I was fascinated about by Rob is that he spent a lot of time

00:55:57.540 --> 00:56:27.340
I'm in Philadelphia when I was living around like just north of the city he was there constantly and then he was like shagging Marines at Cam Pendleton left and right to the point that he got kicked off the base. They identified him and I'm like sir there's like this gay porn scandal and your lead singer Jews priest you're not welcome on the space anymore and I'm like dude this guy loves Marines. Army guys literally loves Marines. Yeah. Hey John did you I forgot.

00:56:27.540 --> 00:56:57.500
if you got tickets for the priest tour no okay well then i'm not going to ruin anything for you but i because i already saw the set list okay all right yeah enough that's exactly what i was going to comment on i was going to say real quick i uh was supposed to meet dio back oh god over 10 years ago uh just before he died he was going to be the best man at a wedding that i was invited to and i flew out for it is this your photographer friend yep i was more friends with um

00:56:57.520 --> 00:57:27.500
his wife and I was all like wow this is gonna be awesome and uh he passed I was like fuck and I felt bad more for um my friend's husband because that was his really good friend yeah and it was just a bummer yeah slash was still there right yeah slash was there uh geezer butler was there for a while um it guys don't go to the way you went to the way I was there oh yeah yeah uh John Payne which you guys probably don't know him but he he's a pretty big musician and

00:57:27.540 --> 00:57:57.280
The Prog World. Mike Akrafo was there from Opeth. Somebody else was there. I got called. Did he know the photographer? Yeah, everyone. That's how everyone was there because the guys. Do you guys know the live and loud Ozzy? If there's a picture in there where Ozzy has his arms out like this and he's like red. I think he's red and the background's blue or he's blue and the background's red or whatever. It's an amazing picture. Gene took that picture.

00:57:59.259 --> 00:58:03.480
So it was kind of bittersweet, but I was happy to go to the wedding, but I was kind of bummed.

00:58:03.680 --> 00:58:27.500
I think I tell this story every time John tells that story, which is not terribly often, so that's not calling you out. But I've told that story before. I shook his hand one time, and I'm pleased to say I did, and I was at a show. It was the Heaven and Hell reunion, or reunion, Heaven and Hell. And he came way the fuck out in the audience in Mountain View. I was at that amphitheater up there, John, whose name is me right now. Shoreline. Shoreline. And there's this little running thing that goes up around the stairs that's just

00:58:27.540 --> 00:58:57.500
down and he just came way the fuck up and and and everybody was just like looking at him gobsmacked i was like fuck it i'm walking over to him so i walk over and shook his hand and the next thing everybody came over but it was still a highlight to me that i shook his fucking hand man you touched god well you know every time john tells that story and then every time jay tells that story then i tell my story which is that i saw dio in the record theater in in towson maryland which is the smallest tiny fucking hole in the wall club and so i was only like 10

00:58:57.520 --> 00:59:27.260
feet away from Dio, which is about the best I could ever do, which is not shaking his hand. But I still have to say it because Jay said his story and John said his story. So that's what we got to do. Right. My story is I saw him with heaven and hell and I was like, way the fuck back. Well, then I have to say, oh, yeah, well, I saw him on the mob rules tour, but I was way in the back. So, hey, Will, what are you holding in your hand there? Oh, I was going to say, so reading the book, you find out that Dio was a huge baseball fan.

00:59:27.500 --> 00:59:28.880
And so for

00:59:30.780 --> 00:59:31.580
It was

00:59:33.000 --> 00:59:33.980
Just a couple weeks ago

00:59:34.120 --> 00:59:35.400
They had like a big anniversary

00:59:36.680 --> 00:59:37.640
Like live concert

00:59:38.180 --> 00:59:39.000
For Dio

00:59:39.700 --> 00:59:41.080
And one of the things you could buy was like

00:59:41.120 --> 00:59:42.640
You know a ticket and all this stuff

00:59:42.760 --> 00:59:43.400
And then a baseball

00:59:43.680 --> 00:59:46.060
So this is a quasi autographed

00:59:47.500 --> 00:59:48.280
Hologram baseball?

00:59:49.100 --> 00:59:50.620
No no it's just because it's in the kit

00:59:50.720 --> 00:59:51.700
Yeah so that's

00:59:51.880 --> 00:59:52.980
Quasi autographed?

00:59:54.180 --> 00:59:55.060
Well it's got his

00:59:56.520 --> 00:59:57.480
It's digital

00:59:59.020 --> 01:00:27.440
He did not sign them. Hey, John, at the wedding, did they mention Dio? Did they give a tribute or say anything about him? No, I think at that point. I don't know. There were so many people there. It would have been weird. You guys will remember the Dio estate sale a while back, too. I still, to this day, regret not because I could have blown $800 on a sword. I could do that. I don't know what I was thinking. One of the things that really intrigued me. You know what? You've paid $800.

01:00:27.500 --> 01:00:54.700
I was to blow a sword. So blow on a sword. Big difference. Um, and, um, but one of the things that was a lot of his estate stuff was baseball stuff. And he had like all these great things like, um, his personal collection of cards and like he had a D O Cleveland, uh, Indians, like shirt, you know, like a uniform and stuff. And I, I would have called a Jersey one of those. Thank you. Outfit. Um, I would have loved to have had one.

01:00:57.480 --> 01:01:26.860
What? It's tops. Your baseball attire. I think I tried to bid on his passport. Because it had his. Yeah. Oh, really? Yeah. I remember that. His real last name in there. There was some Motorhead stuff, too. It was Phil. Yeah, it was Phil's stuff. Yeah. Jay, I was going to ask you, when you were reading the book, was there anything that you were really surprised by? Because, you know, you wrote that feature for the website.

01:01:27.480 --> 01:01:27.960
All and All.

01:01:28.700 --> 01:01:30.860
So I'm just wondering, is there anything you took away

01:01:32.120 --> 01:01:33.780
that you were surprised by?

01:01:34.520 --> 01:01:36.620
Because obviously you're a scholar of Dio.

01:01:37.440 --> 01:01:40.560
I'd like to think I am, to the point where I've wanted to send Wendy Dio

01:01:41.800 --> 01:01:43.560
that article just to say, please consider

01:01:44.000 --> 01:01:46.480
talking to me for your fucking upcoming documentary, but whatever.

01:01:48.360 --> 01:01:51.540
Anyway, no, but here's what's surprising to me about Dio,

01:01:51.540 --> 01:01:53.780
and this was true before the book, and that is that,

01:01:54.420 --> 01:01:57.460
and you guys might forget this, I bet you George will remember

01:01:57.460 --> 01:02:27.440
some of the other guys honestly deal was pretty fucking bitter from like 90 to like 2000 like he was pissed at everybody ever worked with and he threw them all under the bus and said terrible things about him um everybody seriously dude like there's this one famous interview on a bus where he's like going through the records and and if it's like a richard blackmore record he'll be just like that one fucking sucks it's got a 14 minute drum so i hate it you know what i mean and he just deal was mad for a long time so that so i would say this and the surprise to me is that that he

01:02:27.460 --> 01:02:57.440
No, not the surprise, the relief was that that bitterness left him, I think. And the bitterness is in his lyrics, too. So, you know, like we've talked about that, like with Strange Highways and some of the stuff on Lock Up the Wolves, which, by the way, if you want a good cry while you're reading this book, listen to the song Rock and Roll Eyes or my eyes on Lock Up the Wolves. That'll fucking destroy you. So, no, I wasn't too surprised, in all honesty. I think he that's what's so great about Dio is he's the authentic

01:02:57.480 --> 01:03:27.440
He never pretended to be anything he fucking wasn't. He was always straightforward, right? And don't fucking go anywhere in a car or a plane with Dio. Yeah. I liked how honest he was about his youth because I always thought Dio was kind of, he used to hide his age. You may remember that too. He wouldn't tell people how old he was. We didn't really find out until he died. And I liked very much that he was very transparent about it.

01:03:27.480 --> 01:03:57.440
I grew up in the 50s. I hit the pompadour. You know what I mean? I was in this kind of band. Played the stand-up bass. That may sound dumb, but he made his piece, I think is what I'm trying to say. To be fair, he also kind of re-embraced success towards the end of his life too. With Heaven and Hell and all that. I remember reading in Hip Parader magazine in the late 80s an interview with him. I'll always remember this. He said, I think I'm going to die soon. He had this like...

01:03:57.460 --> 01:04:26.900
Like, you know, fatalistic and like, I don't think I'm going to be around much longer. And he was off by a couple of decades. But, you know, I was just always like, oh, shit, do you think he's going to die? And, you know, it worked. To this day, and I know you guys agree on a certain level, it's so hard to really single anybody out. But he is just one of my single favorite figures in heavy metal, period. Yep, me too. For size of talent, for,

01:04:27.460 --> 01:04:57.120
The Way He Writes Lyrics, which honestly people have long made fun of for no good fucking reason. Yeah, right. You know what I mean? And like black and white, day and night, shut the fuck up. I can't stand when people dig on that. And I just think he's the real deal. I was so glad to get this book and I can't wait for the documentary. I think it's a great book. My first deal exposure, I mean, in depth, sadly, was that first Sam Dunn documentary. I think he interviewed him a couple of times in there and just being like, of all the people he talked to,

01:04:57.460 --> 01:05:26.500
Dio's interview, probably aside from the guy, aside from Galdar, Dio's documentary. Satan. Satan was the one that stood out to me the most, just by like what his personality was like, you know, the jabs at Gene Simmons. And prior to that, musically, it was probably, was it Wayne's World? Or the Black Sabbath? Finacious D. I machine, which I fucking loved. And so, you know, a lot of Dio's stuff for me has been looking back and, um,

01:05:27.460 --> 01:05:27.740
You know,

01:05:31.060 --> 01:05:31.640
obviously Jay,

01:05:31.860 --> 01:05:32.000
you're,

01:05:32.200 --> 01:05:34.360
you're the piece you wrote kind of got me started,

01:05:35.080 --> 01:05:35.380
but then,

01:05:35.480 --> 01:05:35.700
you know,

01:05:35.760 --> 01:05:36.580
to read this and,

01:05:36.800 --> 01:05:36.920
you know,

01:05:37.140 --> 01:05:38.060
fill it in even further.

01:05:38.610 --> 01:05:38.980
And yeah,

01:05:39.280 --> 01:05:39.740
that's been cool.

01:05:40.960 --> 01:05:42.980
And just to say one more thing about the on that is that,

01:05:43.120 --> 01:05:43.640
and this is true.

01:05:43.720 --> 01:05:45.520
And this is another fact you guys know about it,

01:05:45.600 --> 01:05:47.360
but he was the last one to fucking leave,

01:05:47.560 --> 01:05:47.640
dude,

01:05:47.640 --> 01:05:48.520
he would come out.

01:05:48.980 --> 01:05:50.300
And if there were 400 people back,

01:05:50.480 --> 01:05:50.640
you know,

01:05:50.760 --> 01:05:51.400
by the bus,

01:05:51.480 --> 01:05:53.180
he'd sign all 400 fucking autographs.

01:05:53.180 --> 01:05:53.700
And that guy,

01:05:54.130 --> 01:05:54.380
you know,

01:05:54.560 --> 01:05:56.880
did truly give a fucking shit about his fans.

01:05:57.740 --> 01:06:26.540
Not just in some sort of like, this will make more popular way. That was his life. That's who he was singing for. You know those live albums we just got recently, Markisan that? I believe it's on that one where he says, he introduces Don't Talk to Strangers and he says, so now we're going to play a song and I kind of say, and he's sincere, he says, I hate saying the name of the song every night because it sounds so negative and none of us are fucking strangers. But in any case, Don't Talk to Strangers.

01:06:26.840 --> 01:06:56.520
But I just love that he sort of always felt bad about the name of that song because he didn't want his fans to feel like strangers. We're strangers from each other. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, what a motherfucker he was. It's true. Yeah. It was it was nice to read about all that his whole life like the early early early in his life and just everything about him that I actually didn't know a lot about, you know, stealing his dad's car either. I hope they do another one.

01:06:56.580 --> 01:07:26.480
because I know that he gave Wendy extensive notes. Yeah. So maybe there would be a sequel to talk about what it was like for him to battle Cancer and the years beyond Sacred Heart. But yeah. Yeah. I think I told you guys this once too. Actually, I have one more comment. I apologize, but we're talking about Dio. And it was just that I always love that Scotty in one said to him, like, what do you do to warm up, man? Like you're fucking amazing. And Dio's thing. He's like, it's not that old man. I smoke a joint. I go out. And then I mean, that was Dio's thing. Yeah. He never warmed up.

01:07:26.580 --> 01:07:56.460
I never fucking took any classical training. He's just, well, that's the way he says in the book too. I opened my mouth and the sound came out. Yeah. It's funny because in the book, he kind of downplays like the drugs and stuff. Cause I don't think he did a lot of hard drugs and he even kind of downplays the amount of pop. But then I remember that comment. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You were a pothead dude. Like don't, don't, he's seen the downplay a little bit in the book. I think he smoked every day. I think it was exactly. That's my point. I mean, the book does, we keep making comments, but,

01:07:56.580 --> 01:08:25.520
The book does a really good job of having a conversational tone where you feel like you know Dio when you're reading it. And I like that part of it because he was a very real person and it comes across in that book really well. Sometimes that's hard with biographies. You didn't always get that, but I definitely felt that when I was reading it. You know, it's funny you say that, Markisan, because there was a couple times where later on in the book you have Dio talking and then there is like italics where it's Wendy.

01:08:25.600 --> 01:08:55.520
where it's Wendy talking. And then sometimes I kind of forget that I'm reading that Wendy's talking and then I pick up when Dio's talking and I get super confused, maybe in the beer. And then I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa. And I have to go back and like, oh, Dio's talking now. Yeah, I did that too. It is that very conversational tone. Yeah, I love that. Actually, let me point out too that Bari. Welcome to the Dio podcast. Bari and Mick Wall, one of the things that impressed me,

01:08:55.600 --> 01:09:25.580
about both of those books is that neither of them has a ghost writer. Those guys wrote those fucking books. They're good writers. And that's not common. Most fucking music biographies have a ghost writer. That's why I was wondering what Mick did. Just he took the organized it helped. No, he helped close some things that were left open and probably did some organizing, but there it wasn't in the finished state. We write it in. Let's put it that way. He had to bring it to that. Because, you know, it was interesting because, you know, when Wendy came in, they noted it. And so I was

01:09:25.620 --> 01:09:55.580
expecting something for Mick and there just wasn't. They talk about me a lot, I think. Or something. There's a foreword or something where she talks about what Mick did. Okay. So how many, since I've been on. Since I've been on. Since you've been on. Like one and a half items. Yeah, pretty much. No, no, no. We're doing pretty good. We're almost done with news. Almost. I shudder to mention this last

01:09:55.600 --> 01:09:56.220
Last news item,

01:09:57.200 --> 01:09:58.640
because we'll never get off this either,

01:09:59.340 --> 01:10:01.820
but the decibel metal and beer fest.

01:10:01.820 --> 01:10:02.580
You can get me off.

01:10:03.220 --> 01:10:03.800
I do.

01:10:06.180 --> 01:10:06.600
What's that?

01:10:06.760 --> 01:10:07.820
Which is next month,

01:10:08.860 --> 01:10:09.140
supposedly,

01:10:09.640 --> 01:10:16.220
allegedly in Philadelphia is supposedly happening and we're going

01:10:16.600 --> 01:10:17.400
supposedly allegedly,

01:10:20.080 --> 01:10:25.460
but Philadelphia is requiring vaccination or proof of,

01:10:25.540 --> 01:10:54.640
a negative COVID test. And now so is, of course, the Fillmore in Philadelphia. And so is Atlas. And so is Atlas. You guys followed suit. Yeah. Anyway, so I think this is a good thing because, you know, obviously if you're vaccinated or have had, I mean, the negative COVID test thing is kind of like a backdoor to trouble to me. And I don't mean Eric Wagner.

01:10:56.340 --> 01:11:25.520
Well, it's actually kind of bullshit because you could pick up. Right. It just has to be the last 72 hours, but you could pick it up. The day before. Yeah. So I'm not a fan of that. I don't know why they do that, but I guess money is probably the reason. It's all legal, too. I'm sure it is. I'm sure there's a lot of legality involved in them being able to do that. Yeah. So people have an out. Discrimination. Yeah. But hopefully this will lead to a safe

01:11:25.560 --> 01:11:55.520
for a decibel and metal and beer fest and we will all arrive and have a joyous and wonderful time i i gotta be honest with you guys i don't know how they're going to do it if you're the other thing too is you have to be required to wear a mask at all times in the venue only if you're not vaccinated and eating and drinking how is that going to work i mean nobody's going to have a mask on that if they're drinking well right that especially the the the the

01:11:55.560 --> 01:12:23.580
The choice was either you have to wear a mask or you have to be vaccinated. I thought it was everyone now had to. Yeah, like DC is you have to be wearing a mask. Whether you're vaccinated or not, you have to wear a mask. Maybe it changed since I saw it. And that's why Albert made the comment in his post on Facebook, or maybe it was Decibel, I don't know who that, they're trying to work through what they're going to do with the breweries because they're all inside the venue.

01:12:24.360 --> 01:12:25.500
where the bands are playing.

01:12:27.540 --> 01:12:33.660
And I just can't imagine that a lot of people are going to have the monitor drinking inside the venue.

01:12:33.860 --> 01:12:35.420
You know what drinking beer is with a mask?

01:12:35.780 --> 01:12:36.840
It's called waterboarding.

01:12:38.040 --> 01:12:41.000
I mean, what happens when you get on the boat and you don't even know what the fuck's going on?

01:12:41.480 --> 01:12:43.300
I mean, are you going to be wearing a mask then?

01:12:44.140 --> 01:12:45.480
There's no way they're going to be able to enforce it.

01:12:46.360 --> 01:12:48.700
So I watch a lot of WWE, right?

01:12:48.980 --> 01:12:50.880
So now they have crowds and you see them.

01:12:50.880 --> 01:12:52.000
They're supposed to be able to wear a mask.

01:12:52.040 --> 01:12:58.240
and you see people with masks on their chins. You see people with masks completely off. And there's nobody going around

01:12:58.340 --> 01:13:21.480
and be like, put your mask back on. It's going to be the same thing with Decibel. It's going to be chaotic. Well, the thing, the difference here, though, is that it's you can only take it off if you're eating or drinking. If they had no. So if you have a beer in your hand, you're good. That's the point. Are they going to change that? So I just think it's going to be a clusterfuck, to be honest with you. Well, I think they should, if they're going to allow that, they still should have to be vaccinated.

01:13:22.540 --> 01:13:51.480
You can't come in and wear a mask if you're unvaxxed. And I'm pretty sure you can't. So if you're vaxxed, I don't care if you're wearing a mask. I mean, well, if you have the COVID tests in 72 hours and you're not vaccinated, you could come in. Right. That's the problem. That's the whole reason why I'm saying it's it's I think they have a lot of logistics to work out still for this. If there was no brewery, say that I'd be like, oh, it's like another indoor. I mean, this is going to be this is what we're going to be facing.

01:13:51.760 --> 01:14:21.500
come just two weeks from now or two and a half weeks from now at atlas is we have the same policy it's kind of like the it's kind of like the the live venue policy you know dc is back to wearing masks indoors and if we want to have a show which we are for show september 11th there was we wear masks and at when you when you saw when you enter that door you have to show us a either physical or digital copy

01:14:21.540 --> 01:14:29.560
of your vaccination certificate or a physical or digital copy of your negative COVID test in the last 72 hours.

01:14:29.940 --> 01:14:48.960
Well, I want to follow that up with some. What does Atlas have to do for the customers to feel comfortable with the people who are working? Because if all the customers are required to show proof, if you're there, you know, like you said, this is only show nights. So this is only for sure.

01:14:48.980 --> 01:15:17.540
I know that, but there's people that are working there, and it's the same for in Philadelphia at the Fillmore. If you're required, you can't get in unless you have those two things. I would think then that they're requiring the people working to do it. The staff should. Yeah, I'm assuming. Knowing Atlas, every single person who's working there has a vaccination. Sure, I understand. But at Philadelphia, that's nothing that Albert or Dust Bowl can control. No, we can control that. Yeah, you guys can.

01:15:17.620 --> 01:15:47.380
Yeah. But it just seems a little, and I'm not going at any concerns, right? I just feel like they're going to do that. You gotta, I mean, listen, there's a high probability we're going to get, we're going to get the Delta variant. That's my whole point. I've known a couple of people who are vaccinated, who still got the Delta variant or still got, I said, sorry, they still got COVID. How did they fare? By the way, they do. Okay. It was minor. Anybody who got it,

01:15:47.640 --> 01:16:17.340
That was vaccinated. It was very minor. That's the whole point. It's kind of like getting the flu shot. You can still get the flu, but you're not going to get super sick from it. If you get it wiped out. I should with this Delta variant, which I don't know if either one of them got the Delta variant, but they both got sick and they both tested positive for COVID, but it was kind of like, Hey, you got the sniffles, you got the cough, you got a little fever. It was kind of like getting a cold. Like Bruce Dickinson. That's why Bruce got it. I forgot. Yeah. But then we come home to your family.

01:16:17.620 --> 01:16:47.440
That's the big deal. I was going to go travel to my family after, but I decided not to just because my parents have some conditions. I'm not bringing anything to them. Exactly. I'm planning on probably getting tested as soon as I get home just because I don't want to give anything to Jen. That's a good idea, John. You should always get a test for gonorrhea when you go away. Whenever you hang out with the Metal Hats podcast. Exactly, Mark.

01:16:47.620 --> 01:17:17.600
I was just going to say. Which, you know, we know a lot of people go into this thing. I'm like, oh, you know, it'll be just us. And then it's like, oh, wait, well, Jeff and Steph are going. And I think John BT is going. I mean, the good news is that we're all vaccinated and we're going to be hanging out a lot. Justin's going and Nick from Facebook, he's going. Justin, yeah. Yeah, yeah, Justin. How fucking cool is this? So last episode we had Justin on and he was like, yeah, I'm

01:17:17.640 --> 01:17:45.920
Trying to find tickets, blah, blah, blah. Right after the episode posted, Jeff of Jeff and Steph gets a hold of me and he's like, hey, man, I got two extra tickets if Justin wants them. And I was like, you're fucking kidding me. And he's like, yeah, man. And so I hooked the two guys up and Justin's going now. But, you know, I thought that was also going to be coming, I think. So that's pretty cool. The captain's coming. Who is? The captain's going to be coming. The captain. He's like my best friend from Chicago.

01:17:47.040 --> 01:18:16.720
And he posts on the board a few times. So yeah, he's cool. I think he's only coming for one day because the tickets were like sold out for like one day. Speaking of people in one day, is not the Metalheads Butler going for a day? He's going for one day too. Metalheads Butler! Metalheads Butler! Do you guys know if there's going to be a pre-show? There is not. There's actually another show happening in the upstairs.

01:18:17.040 --> 01:18:46.940
that day. Well, yeah, I know that. I think I told you about that. Cause there's two pre-shows. There's a, there's a show a week in advance. So Atlas hosted that one show hosted that show two or three years ago. And then there's a show the night before. Yeah. So there's kind of like two pre-shows. Yeah. They're doing like a dead guy, a documentary that I was thinking about going, but I was like, well, I wonder if they're going to have like a pre-show. So that's why I ask. So maybe I'll just get tickets to that dead guy. Pre-show is cheesesteaks, cheesesteaks and wieners. I plan on eating cheesesteaks for,

01:18:47.020 --> 01:19:17.000
every single meal. I've actually planned it out. I'm thinking that too, man. I was like, you know, once was not enough last time. We need to go more once. I've had a hoagie in a long time. Oh, God, I can't wait. Yeah. I can't wait to see you guys. It's pretty soon. This is a fucking month. I know. Assuming it's going to be on, of course. Yeah. You don't want to assume anything. Anything could happen between now and then. Let's move on and not jinx it anymore because the more we talk about it, the more we're keeping

01:19:17.040 --> 01:19:19.740
I gotta piss though before new releases

01:19:20.240 --> 01:19:20.580
yeah

01:19:22.060 --> 01:19:23.000
we'll take a quick

01:19:23.700 --> 01:19:24.220
take a quick

01:19:26.699 --> 01:19:28.780
you're listening to the mental heads podcast

01:19:29.500 --> 01:19:30.360
and if you don't listen

01:19:31.020 --> 01:19:31.840
then the hell with you

01:19:32.140 --> 01:19:34.800
alright let's move on to new releases

01:19:44.940 --> 01:19:47.000
first up we have the new

01:19:47.000 --> 01:20:14.840
album that I didn't even know was coming until it dropped was the new Between the Buried and Me album Colors 2. This is their North Carolina band's 10th album. It's like proggy. It's definitely proggy. I don't know, proggy death-ish. What would you call it, John? Did you listen to it or listen to it half-assedly like the other albums? I listened intently for the first several songs and then continued working my ass off. It's long. It's like 78 minutes long.

01:20:17.020 --> 01:20:46.680
When I started listening to it, I was like, is this a Coldplay album? Because the very first song is so fucking Coldplay until it gets heavy. That's the Deaf Heaven album. Yeah, and then at some point, I looked up and I said, hey, this sounds kind of Voivod-ish. And I was like, wait, didn't their last album sound kind of Voivod-ish? Yeah. I had no idea it was coming out of it either. And I'm not a big fan, but I said to George, I feel like I should like these guys for some reason, and I don't. And I listened, and I was like, I kind of like this album. It's not bad. It's all right.

01:20:47.000 --> 01:21:16.980
I've been digging deeper into their stuff. I know, George, you told me there's a few albums I should have. A while back, you told me to check out a couple albums. I've seen them so many times on tour, and they're not the band you want to see on tour to get into. It is weird, John, because they're progressive. They check all the boxes, but I just don't have a special feeling for them, I guess. I'm the same way, because I didn't like any of this stuff. When they were on Victory, I was like, I'm not going to even check them out. I know these Victory bands, but they sound like

01:21:17.780 --> 01:21:46.400
And his harsh vocals are very victory all the way through. They sound like those bands. And it always turned me off. But the music, the playing is out. Those guys are just unbelievable musicians. Whether you like it or not. I mean, it's like, fuck. The Parallax 2 was the one that brought me in. So like nine years ago. And Coma Ecliptic was really good. That was actually the one that was very voivant to me. You just can't see them live and say, oh, I like this band.

01:21:46.440 --> 01:21:50.780
because you'd be like wait a minute they don't stop for like 60 minutes you know it's like fuck

01:21:52.000 --> 01:21:57.880
it's exhausting when i was coming out of my shitty metal phase um colors one of the things i cut my

01:21:57.940 --> 01:22:03.560
teeth on and just kind of fell in love with you know the genre as i evolved i don't listen to them as

01:22:03.680 --> 01:22:08.880
much but this is the sequel to that yeah well and that's why i need to kind of you know i i kind of

01:22:09.040 --> 01:22:12.500
skimmed it a little bit and that's funny with the deaf heaven comic because that's i think what i

01:22:12.500 --> 01:22:16.100
I listened to after as I was going through things and I was like what the fuck

01:22:17.320 --> 01:22:22.180
but yeah I'm going to spend some more time with this one I think I think I'll just make one comment

01:22:22.280 --> 01:22:28.140
and I was going to make one too right that the decimal gave deaf heaven a high

01:22:29.380 --> 01:22:34.680
number in their latest magazine but admitted that this is not even metal I think they gave it an eight

01:22:35.220 --> 01:22:40.860
yeah yeah it's going to be a metal yeah well hello the last the cover of the last issue

01:22:40.880 --> 01:23:10.720
was the lingua whatever, and that's not even remotely metal. I tried listening to that. Man, I don't get that. I just don't get it. I tried. I love him so much. I've ripped on it so much, and I had a conversation with James about this, and I was trying to keep it light, and he just didn't take it the way I wanted him to. But I actually can tolerate this album because it's not trying to be metal. Talking about Deaf Heaven or? The lingua.

01:23:10.860 --> 01:23:40.540
We've moved Lingua, whatever. Ingata? Yeah. And I was like, oh, I know what this is. This is Mircore. I do a really heavy, noisy, black metal-ish album, and then I do something that's clean. And that's not meant to be a gripe on Mircore, because I like Mircore. That's what I thought. It's a neo-folk and dark way. That's what I thought. I don't get it. I really don't understand.

01:23:40.560 --> 01:24:10.480
This album's kind of fucked up because of our like random screaming and shit. But I like it better than whatever the fuck that last album was. So moving on, you guys hear the new carcass? Yeah. Did you know that it's got a book? I thought we were talking about Between the Baird and May. All right. Oh, I did want to mention the new carcass. I did want to mention the Deaf Heaven comment that Clanchar made. Dan was like, you know, I feel like this is the lane they should have been in all the time. Maybe I said,

01:24:10.560 --> 01:24:40.500
that part, but essentially I was confirming what he said that this new Deaf Heaven album sounds like what they should have been doing all along. And I completely agreed with that. I'm like, this is a like post rock band that was trapped in a black metal body. And I'm like, this is, I haven't listened to the whole thing. I've, I've spot listened to it. And I was like, yeah, it says, you know, this is, this is all right. This is okay. Compared to what they used to do. I actually, I actually like it. I actually like the new Deaf Heaven album.

01:24:40.580 --> 01:25:09.640
A lot more. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. It's that reason. I haven't. It's shoegaze. It's, it's shoegaze, light shoegaze, really. But he's not like, you know, no Mars attacks. All right. Now we can move on to carcass. Um, we'll go. We'll go. Yeah. Torn arteries. Their seventh album makes me hungry because of all the veg on the cover.

01:25:12.140 --> 01:25:13.020
Veg, not Veg.

01:25:15.640 --> 01:25:17.260
Go ahead, Will. You wanted to talk about this one.

01:25:19.400 --> 01:25:20.700
Nope. We get a sound effect.

01:25:20.960 --> 01:25:22.640
I don't know how to operate technology.

01:25:23.140 --> 01:25:24.060
Here's my merch.

01:25:25.040 --> 01:25:25.700
I like my

01:25:25.700 --> 01:25:27.160
slow now.

01:25:27.660 --> 01:25:28.440
My process.

01:25:29.700 --> 01:25:31.120
I like my french fry potatoes.

01:25:33.320 --> 01:25:34.640
With some carcass.

01:25:35.040 --> 01:25:36.600
Put the lotion in the basket.

01:25:37.340 --> 01:25:37.820
Sometimes.

01:25:38.760 --> 01:25:39.240
Sometimes.

01:25:40.260 --> 01:25:41.840
You know, the carcass.

01:25:41.840 --> 01:25:43.520
It's a bode wall for the review of the album.

01:25:43.670 --> 01:25:44.500
This is what we're doing.

01:25:45.400 --> 01:25:47.180
I listen to it on my Blackberry.

01:25:48.200 --> 01:25:50.940
Sometimes life is like a box of carcass.

01:25:51.620 --> 01:25:52.940
Mixing my movies here.

01:25:54.620 --> 01:25:56.940
I like how me, Matt and John have inside jokes.

01:25:57.560 --> 01:25:57.980
That boy.

01:25:58.200 --> 01:25:59.280
That's it, my Blackberry.

01:25:59.920 --> 01:26:00.480
Give me the carcass.

01:26:00.480 --> 01:26:04.340
His heart, and his heart is a big place to live for a boy like that.

01:26:04.760 --> 01:26:06.180
And his heart is made out of vegetables.

01:26:07.160 --> 01:26:07.940
I love this part.

01:26:08.190 --> 01:26:08.860
I like you.

01:26:21.620 --> 01:26:33.300
que é um pouco mais rápido.

01:26:39.000 --> 01:27:08.980
It's slower than like surgical steel. I think it's better than surgical steel. And Jay, you're I'm quoting you in the inner thread when you said this album has got some sick grooves and it's precision aggression. Well, you know what it's got to it's like it's this is has in my mind. This has Bill Steers stamp all over it because Bill's the fucking you know, he's got the what do you call them the bell bottoms and all that and this kind of has some stonery doomy riffs on it, but carcassized. And then

01:27:09.480 --> 01:27:38.080
And there's so much I like on it. It goes to a lot of cool, weird places. But I think my favorite Carcass song ever is... I just don't want to get the title wrong because it's long, like all Carcass titles. Flesh Ripping, Sonic Torment Limited. This is a 10-minute epic. And by the way, a British way of saying Damage Incorporated. That's what I was thinking too. Yeah. The whole record's great. But that fucking rollercoaster of a fucking cool song with no cheap riffs in it.

01:27:39.000 --> 01:28:08.860
a high watermark on this record. And the record itself is, this is a contender for me. I fucking love it. It could have been a contender. You know, it's like, this record is a record I listen to and I forget to breathe because I'm just like, where the fuck are they going? But you know where they're going, but you don't know. And your point, Jay, about like, I love Bill Steer's riffs. Like, I just don't know what they're going to sound like, but they just sound so good. Calling it now. Matt's number one.

01:28:08.880 --> 01:28:09.660
Jay's number one,

01:28:09.860 --> 01:28:10.440
Will's number two.

01:28:11.720 --> 01:28:13.240
It could be my whole top five.

01:28:13.430 --> 01:28:13.900
I don't know.

01:28:14.500 --> 01:28:14.600
Well,

01:28:14.610 --> 01:28:16.880
they inject a lot of rock into it too,

01:28:17.120 --> 01:28:18.180
but it's still very,

01:28:18.300 --> 01:28:18.700
very metal,

01:28:18.920 --> 01:28:19.220
but the,

01:28:19.220 --> 01:28:22.520
the rock part of it actually accentuates it,

01:28:22.680 --> 01:28:23.040
highlights it.

01:28:23.320 --> 01:28:23.580
To me,

01:28:23.740 --> 01:28:24.480
it's very aggressive.

01:28:24.640 --> 01:28:25.920
It's an aggressive hook parade.

01:28:26.760 --> 01:28:26.980
Yeah.

01:28:27.460 --> 01:28:28.100
And I,

01:28:28.260 --> 01:28:28.860
I love it.

01:28:28.860 --> 01:28:29.720
I think it's fantastic.

01:28:30.230 --> 01:28:32.560
It could be my favorite carcass record,

01:28:32.670 --> 01:28:33.140
to be honest.

01:28:34.100 --> 01:28:35.280
I'm batting that around too,

01:28:35.680 --> 01:28:36.200
Markisan end.

01:28:36.800 --> 01:29:06.760
A great example of what you're talking about is the last song, The Sides, Remorseless Swing, which opens with this really kind of lush, groovy, almost like the Maiden opening of the Maiden song, right? It's not like that. It's not as western-style. But it's a little bit classic Rocky. And then that's the thing is that then the carcass kind of over, you know, saturation kicks in and it becomes a whole different riff, even though it's the exact same riff. And one of the reasons I said it's like a real Bill Steere record

01:29:06.780 --> 01:29:35.920
because I think his bass has always been a little more classic. You know what I mean? But when you put it through those kinds of amplifiers and play it the way they do, it's different. But it's classic, but it also sounds new, which is amazing because these guys have been around for fucking ever, like 35 years, some shit. It's nuts. I feel like they just keep getting better. I don't know how. You made a powerful statement and I'm going to back you up on it. This might be my favorite Carcass record. I mean, it needs more spin.

01:29:36.880 --> 01:30:06.700
I spun it maybe six times. Yeah. Yeah. So you got to spin it more, but it's great. It's definitely going to be up there on my list. I have no idea where it's going to fall, but of course it's going to be up there. I really regret not doing what Will did, which is I got some special package when I bought, when I ordered it, but we'll get the fucking dinner plate. I think it's still available, isn't it? Maybe I should follow through on that then. I can send George my regular copy. You know, I didn't get, I didn't get one of those shirts. Cause I was like, man, my kids will freak out with that.

01:30:06.800 --> 01:30:36.680
And then George was like, hey, you know what? It's all vegetables. Fuck. I love the cover, actually. I was like, wait a minute, that's a pepper. I like peppers. Did you watch the video, though? Because, of course, in the video, that heart rots. Well, George sent a link for the interview they did, I think, was Rolling Stone or something. Yeah, Rolling Stone. They were talking about that. They really liked the image of the heart because they've done the real carcass stuff so much to death. Right. Well, how about we,

01:30:36.780 --> 01:31:06.720
use some imagery that kind of conveys that, but in a different way. That's because they got the vegan thing with Jeff at least. Well, he said they were worried that people are going to think that, oh, it's the vegan thing, but it's really not that. That's what they said in the interview. Right, right, right. Yeah, that's true. So I like that part of it. I also, by the way, I think I assume the devil rides out and I can, from what I can make out lyrically is about the British movie, the devil rides out, which is like one of my favorite kind of weird seventies satanic exploitation movies.

01:31:06.800 --> 01:31:36.680
is great. And I'm sure, I can't imagine that they're not big fans of that. I'll just say again, I think they're super clever. They're just a cut above. There's nobody like them, which maybe you could say about every band we like, but they're just so unique. And they're firing on all cylinders. So I am not disappointed in this record. It exceeded my expectations. John, what did you think of it? You haven't said anything yet. I'm not a super Carcass fan. I've got most of their stuff and I like them. I think I probably like them better live than I do on Al,

01:31:38.000 --> 01:32:06.760
I thought it was good I won't it won't be as high if it makes my list like you guys but I do like it I was with George in that Wilson award yeah well no that's not a Wilson award that's a that's a that's a J but I don't really care because I got plenty of stuff to put on my list this year I got too much actually but I agree with George I listened to it and yeah it's aggressive but it they definitely are

01:32:06.780 --> 01:32:36.760
have continued down this. It's not like this should be a shock to people. They've been doing this ever since Swan Song. They've just slightly tweaked their sound every album. Yes. You know, and so, but I like it. It's cool. Yeah, I'm not a super fan like you guys. That's all. Well, that's what you hit upon something I really like. They tweak their sound every album, and I like that you get something a little bit different each time. It's recognizably carcass, but it's a little bit different. They use their influences. They use, you know, what they've learned or something that they've, that's

01:32:36.800 --> 01:32:39.240
What happened to them in their lives and then put it into the record.

01:32:40.180 --> 01:32:42.460
We'll say this, the opening track is an absolute banger.

01:32:44.220 --> 01:32:47.540
And then I heard the second track, I was like, ah, not so big on the second one.

01:32:47.960 --> 01:32:53.760
You know, I'm going to tell you, go listen to the, you know, Sonic Flesh Ripping Torment.

01:32:53.900 --> 01:32:56.140
If anybody, like that's my sales pitch for this record is that song.

01:32:57.260 --> 01:32:58.500
Certainly I like it better than the EP.

01:32:58.660 --> 01:32:59.540
I wasn't big on the EP.

01:32:59.600 --> 01:33:00.760
I thought the EP was just okay.

01:33:01.140 --> 01:33:01.520
Yeah, me too.

01:33:01.600 --> 01:33:04.640
Sonic Flesh Ripping Torment is my pitch for everything.

01:33:06.180 --> 01:33:34.620
You know, my personal final comment is, because I've said plenty, but it's that it's got a lot more low end than Surgical Steel did, too, which is fine with me. I don't have a problem with that one way or another, but it's definitely got a lot more bottom end to it. I also think that Sonic should make a big bottom. Called Flesh Ripping Torment. Cock has got them. Sonic Flesh Ripping Torment. And a veggie burger. Yeah. Damn right. Like a heart. It's just like a heart would be great, Sean.

01:33:36.120 --> 01:33:36.780
16 jalapenos.

01:33:39.420 --> 01:33:41.760
You know, like a big old watermelon and carve it out.

01:33:42.900 --> 01:33:45.500
My, my initial comment was, I wish it was heavier.

01:33:46.260 --> 01:33:53.660
And then, uh, and then I read, I think it was the Rolling Stone interview, but it might've been a desk, the decibel one. I don't know. I read them both.

01:33:54.240 --> 01:34:03.720
Um, where I think it was, Bill said, you know, we don't have to be like as heavy as we used to be. There's like, we're, we're fucking old and shit.

01:34:03.780 --> 01:34:32.900
And I'm paraphrasing here. He's like, there's newer bands. If you, you know, there's plenty of bands doing like super heavy shit, if that's what you want. And I was like, all right, fair enough. So I, I will concede that. It's the colors that I like on the record. Yeah, for sure. And there's plenty of it. If you can go through it two or three times, you're going to find stuff on there. That's like, Ooh, you know, you're like, wow, that was a weird little turn left turn. But George, you also be used to be a bit heavier.

01:34:32.980 --> 01:35:02.920
And now you're not and you're better for it. So hey, word. Fair enough. Profound shit. What? By the way, so I also like, you know, I have to say Albert likes to get a lot of repeat bands on Decibel, as we all know. Like there's certain bands that kind of seem to be showing up every year, more or less pretty consistently. Pig Destroyer would be one of them. Why don't you bring Carcass every year, dude? Fuck, if you're going to double up on somebody.

01:35:03.000 --> 01:35:31.700
Let's move through these next three albums. Well, mostly quick. Album good. Good album move on. Money good. Napster bad. Fast heavy good. Okay. So the next album we have is the new Craven Idol album Forked Tongue. It's their third album. They're a UK black thrash band. They've been well liked on this podcast in the past.

01:35:33.000 --> 01:36:02.420
I know they're well-liked now. By Jay, at least, I like them as well. Well, I think Jay had it as his album of the month last month. That's why I know that he likes it. Stylistically, this is just like right in my wheelhouse. It's that Black and Thrash, as George mentioned, with honestly like a kind of almost Nevermore-y presentation as far as production goes. It's just two tons of metal in your face, dude. This is just a good time, you know, and it's nothing fancy in its way.

01:36:02.500 --> 01:36:32.100
That's maybe a shitty way to put it. Is it like motorboating you? I mean, I would say it's relentless. It's relentless, thrashy black metal with an old soul because it definitely feels like a throwback. It's just, it's pretty fun. And I feel like you probably agree with this, Jay. The album gets stronger as it goes, which is unusual. Yeah. I mean, but you know, and I know that goat horror, they don't sound like goat horror, but this is that kind of band that has an old soul to it, as you say.

01:36:32.500 --> 01:37:02.400
And that's just right in my wheelhouse for some reason. I really appreciate guys that are kind of rooted in the past like that. And it's just a quality record. It's a good time. Right on. I like the elderly. Next up, it's not Fauci. It's Fulci. And that is an Italian death metal band and their third album, Exhumed Information, which I believe is based on a movie. My Cousin Fulci. My Cousin Fulci. It's an Italian horror.

01:37:02.520 --> 01:37:31.020
director. Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah, I know that. Um, and this album, uh, is pretty cool. I like it. It's, it's, um, as bands seem to be doing these days, it's a mix of death metal and synth wave. And in fact, the last three tracks on the album are all synth wave. Um, but it's a pretty cool fucking album. I dig it. Yeah. It was cool. I liked it. Yeah. It was all right.

01:37:32.500 --> 01:38:01.360
I feel like it's fairly standard death metal with a slightly different edge because it's got that synth in it. It's got the... It's not like a lot of bells and whistles to me. I bought it. I liked it. I didn't think there was a lot of synthwave in it. Only the last three songs. I don't really know what synthwave is. It's where there's a complete and total lack of metal. It's only synthesizer. That's the last three tracks on the album. They go death heaven in parts of the album.

01:38:02.500 --> 01:38:32.140
It is something that's we've talked about this recently. This seems to be a new. That's like the lion's daughter thing. And blah, blah. Lion's daughter is not a thing. I'm just saying they I feel like they were an early adopter. Let's put it. If you had met the lion's daughter, you would understand what I mean. Fine. Let's move on. Good. Next. Next. Next. Wolves in the throne room. Prime.

01:38:32.520 --> 01:39:01.760
Arcana, their seventh album of black metal from the state of Washington. And featuring special skills and bass playing and possibly some backup vocals by our friend Galen from what band? Farabra. Farabra. Farabra. The third explosion. So, I mean, I like Wolves in the Throne Room, but something about this one,

01:39:01.780 --> 01:39:30.300
I listened to this on the beach, nobody around, staring at the ocean waves, and I was like, whoa, dude, this is pretty cool. I feel like it's got more low end. It's heavier than typical Washington black metal bands. I think I told John this, that at times it almost feels like death metal because of what they're doing.

01:39:30.920 --> 01:39:32.480
It's not just black metal

01:39:33.140 --> 01:39:34.660
Well you can actually hear the music now

01:39:35.100 --> 01:39:36.760
As opposed to you know those early albums

01:39:36.940 --> 01:39:38.800
Like 12 Stars and Two Hunters

01:39:38.900 --> 01:39:39.540
While they're great

01:39:40.020 --> 01:39:42.000
They are pretty background

01:39:42.500 --> 01:39:42.600
Yeah

01:39:42.920 --> 01:39:44.180
You have to really concentrate

01:39:44.260 --> 01:39:44.340
Atmospheric

01:39:45.140 --> 01:39:45.280
Yeah

01:39:46.040 --> 01:39:47.760
But yeah the production's pretty decent

01:39:48.560 --> 01:39:50.820
And there's some kind of synthy

01:39:51.280 --> 01:39:52.900
Almost synth wavy stuff in there too

01:39:54.420 --> 01:39:55.600
Yeah I'd even go to say that

01:39:55.680 --> 01:39:57.700
It's even almost dungeon wave

01:39:57.820 --> 01:39:59.020
Because it's very medieval

01:39:59.140 --> 01:40:00.040
Some of the rhythms

01:40:00.480 --> 01:40:00.900
Yeah

01:40:00.920 --> 01:40:30.720
But they play the black metal on top of that, which I thought was interesting, as opposed to just like the other album we just talked about from Fulci, where they kind of let the synthwave go off on its own. They actually play on top of that. Yes. Which is kind of cool. It's integrated a lot better. I mean, I love Wolves and the Throne. I think this is a great record. I'm dying to get on vinyl. I know John hasn't on vinyl. I haven't gotten it yet. Yeah, it's good. It's really good. All right. It is a little heavier, I think, than the last record.

01:40:31.240 --> 01:40:32.160
Yeah, it is.

01:40:32.600 --> 01:40:34.620
So, and I like that part of it.

01:40:34.720 --> 01:40:36.240
And they're, I mean, they're so good live.

01:40:36.700 --> 01:40:38.780
So I'm really looking forward to seeing them play.

01:40:38.880 --> 01:40:40.300
Songs are shorter on this album too.

01:40:40.760 --> 01:40:40.880
So.

01:40:41.540 --> 01:40:41.860
You're right.

01:40:41.900 --> 01:40:42.860
As long as they're not focused.

01:40:43.760 --> 01:40:43.820
Yeah.

01:40:44.600 --> 01:40:44.700
So.

01:40:44.960 --> 01:40:45.060
Yeah.

01:40:46.020 --> 01:40:46.300
It's cool.

01:40:46.620 --> 01:40:48.120
You'll probably like it.

01:40:48.520 --> 01:40:48.600
Yeah.

01:40:50.220 --> 01:40:50.800
All right.

01:40:50.920 --> 01:40:52.220
What are we listening to?

01:41:15.300 --> 01:41:17.260
Markisan.

01:41:18.040 --> 01:41:46.700
Oh shit. All right. So my first one is a unrequited, beautiful ghosts on a prophecy productions. This is a breathtaking post black metal record. And just listening to it is like being stabbed with a spectral blade that breaks off in your heart. And then it roots and grows into flowers of soft light inside of you. That's what I feel when I listen to this fucking thing. I love this record. Are there any lyrics at all? Or does he kind of just.

01:41:49.300 --> 01:42:15.840
I haven't looked at lyrics at all, but that's a good question because I have it on vinyl. I haven't actually looked. I'll have to take a look, John. I'm not positive. I feel like there is singing on it. There's a lot of instrumental parts in it. And when they do the black metal vocals, it is kind of in the background. But it works perfectly on this record. So I was a little hesitant when they said that when they announced this album because I love the last record so much.

01:42:16.540 --> 01:42:44.860
I wasn't sure what we were going to get, but I actually, the emotional core of this record really resonates with me. The next record I have on my list is a band called Rye. Now their name and the name of the album is all in Russian. So the name means Rye. I can't pronounce the rest of it. It's on a Reflection Nebula Records. This is just a beautiful haunting album of monstrous black and doom.

01:42:45.440 --> 01:43:14.740
The LP drops at the end of September, but all the songs are up on Bantkeak now. And I've been listening to this a lot lately. So it's one of my favorites actually this year. Can I interrupt? Can I interrupt? Sorry. I'm trying to squeeze an Edward in there. Not that you're talking too much or anything. It's your turn. I was just trying to find a good time to interrupt because I want to talk about you. Me? Yeah.

01:43:14.880 --> 01:43:44.500
My friend Dave texted me today and he was like, dude, man, Markisan really has a way with words. He's like listening to the episodes. He's like, he's like 10 episodes back or whatever, but he's like, wow, man, Markisan really speaks well. He should be like a writer or something. And I was like, um, well, actually. Like, yeah, you should. I'll pass that along. I'll talk to him about that. Buy my comics. Markisan.com. Yeah, I literally.

01:43:44.880 --> 01:44:14.640
I sent him your website. So that's funny. That's cool. That's funny. Yeah. Thought you'd enjoy that. It's yeah, I do. It's weird how much shit cross pollinates because there's people that'll listen to the metalheads podcast and then find my books, my comics and everything. And then it goes the other way to, you know, where they'll read my comics and they see, do the podcast and then they get into it and they're like, Oh, I love that album that you recommended or, you know, John recommended.

01:44:14.900 --> 01:44:44.860
or, well, maybe not will, but you know, what everybody in the podcast recommends. So I think that's really cool. I am enjoying that. And especially bands too. I think that's why I've been booking a lot of bands for the cast because of that cross pollination. It's really weird. All right. Well, thanks for that little, uh, George, uh, veil mist secrets of the ego chasm. One of the

01:44:44.880 --> 01:45:13.660
Worst names for an album ever, but I love this record. It's self-released. It's very inspired, energetic, melodic death metal, and it just bangs from start to finish. And I think this LP actually features some of the best riffs this year. And there's also a guest solo on one track by Tyler Sturgill of Zoth, which we talked about recently with Justin, I think. Yep, he was wearing the shirt. Yes. I really like Veil Mist.

01:45:13.720 --> 01:45:41.900
That's definitely going to be one that flies under the radar. V-A-E-L-M-Y-S-T. I like that one too. It's so good. Enigmatum. I think I said that right. Deconsecrate on 20 bucks spin. Just a sprawling, intricate, and melodic barrage of death metal destruction. It's almost progressive, really. I quite like this record.

01:45:43.480 --> 01:46:13.080
Underdark, Our Bodies Burned Bright on re-entry on Tridroid Records. This is my album of the month last month in July. It's just a really skillful, heavy mix of black metal, post-metal, shoegaze, really dynamic song structures to it. It has varied vocal deliveries that I really appreciate and just engaging lyrics. They have songs about addiction. They have songs about psychosis. They have songs about border control.

01:46:13.480 --> 01:46:43.300
And also Shitty Landlords. So it's just like, it's a really interesting album lyrically. Something maybe Jay would get into because we know that lyrics are very important to him. I would hope that the Shitty Landlords one would have some gang vocals. That's the one gang vocal I would accept that. Fetid Zombie transmutations on transcending obscurity records. I know most of us really dig this record.

01:46:43.480 --> 01:47:13.460
Just jaw, dropping, dropping, death. There you go. Darkly blended with black metal, progressive metal, and just dripping with these ghostly atmospherics that I really like. And some haunting solos. I just like the atmosphere in some of the songs. It's really well done. That is really well done. That one blew me away, because I've heard previous stuff by the band, and I was like, eh, this is cool. But then, which was enough to make me

01:47:13.500 --> 01:47:42.600
I listened to it when I got the promo. And I was like, this was one of those halfway through the album. Wait a minute. Did I hear what I just thought I heard? And I have to start over because it's like so good. Yeah, it's really good. Let's see. Dungeon Serpent, World of Sorrows on Desert Wasteland Productions and also Nameless Grave Records. It's just towering. I would say a maelstrom of layered death.

01:47:43.500 --> 01:48:13.140
with gargantuan fuzz chug guitar attack. I really like this record quite a bit. There's synth on this one as well, since we've been talking about synth. There's definitely some synth on there. And then another record that has some synth on it that I think does it better than most bands, and that's Hellish Form Remains on Translation Loss. This is actually one of my favorite records to play. It's really slow, serpentine,

01:48:17.380 --> 01:48:43.460
I like to play this record at night. Usually when the moon is full and the ocean is completely black. That's the best time to play it. And two more. This is like a George list. It fucking is. Under a Serpent's Sun. Self-titled EP. Just a really excellent high energy blast of death metal. I find myself coming back to it. There's so much

01:48:43.500 --> 01:49:12.740
death metal these days. Um, but this one for some reason just hits me in the right way. And then the last one is a witnesses, the collapse it's self-released. Now this record officially drops on Halloween. Uh, but the pre-order came up and it was put up incorrectly. And so the whole album was downloadable for like an hour and I happened to grab it and I spun it a few times now. And, um, this band surprised me. I think,

01:49:13.500 --> 01:49:14.400
with Doom 2.

01:49:14.780 --> 01:49:14.900
Yeah.

01:49:15.300 --> 01:49:23.600
And that record really merged mammoth, mournful doom with the emotional alt-rock vocals.

01:49:24.520 --> 01:49:27.460
So I fell in love with that sound and it was on my top 25.

01:49:28.700 --> 01:49:32.580
But this new album, it continues in that direction and that's good.

01:49:32.990 --> 01:49:36.440
But there's a new singer on it for some reason.

01:49:36.510 --> 01:49:37.100
I don't know why.

01:49:37.600 --> 01:49:39.400
And I just don't like him as much.

01:49:40.260 --> 01:49:41.060
He's fine.

01:49:41.320 --> 01:50:11.300
His overall delivery though, it just lacks that emotional punch that I was in Doom 2. And unfortunately, I don't feel as much on this record as I did the last one. I'm going to give it some more spins because the new guy is a good singer. But for right now, that's where I stand on it. I just don't like it as much. I don't know why they switched singers. I don't know what they were trying to accomplish with the record because I felt like

01:50:11.320 --> 01:50:40.440
that they hit on something that was unique. I think he was just a guest singer or something. Because it's like the guy that does the music does the music and he just was like, hey, I got this guy to sing. That's right. Because I looked that guy up and he's a guy who just sells his services, right? But this new guy is the same way. So why didn't he just go back with the other guy? Maybe he wanted a raise. Maybe he wanted something. I'm not sure what the deal is. I have gotten kind of a little bit friendly with a guy from Witnesses.

01:50:41.340 --> 01:51:10.500
So maybe somebody we could have on like next year since we're booked up for the end of the year. But yeah, anyways, I like the record. I just I really love the last record. And mostly it was because of the singer from the last record. The music actually may be a little bit better on this record. Anyways, there you go. All right. Matty. All righty. I am mutually exclusive with the new Carcass promo. What I will just say about it is that when I listen to it,

01:51:11.320 --> 01:51:40.240
I am not that you Matt.com. Happy Matt. Good. Exactly. Are you veggie Matt.com? Yeah, I probably should be, but no, I'm not. Vegematic. Am I, uh, yeah. Less carbs, Matt. No. I am jalapeno Matt. So my next one is, and I forgot how I was going to mark it. Spicy Matt. Spicy Matt.com. Sorry, Matt. Go ahead. Or.net.

01:51:41.340 --> 01:52:10.800
I was waiting for you to mention this band because I was going to copy how you pronounced it and I don't remember what you said but I'm going to call them Enigmatum. Not bad. De Consecrate is the album. I remember when the first track came out Forged in Bedlam via 20 Buck Spin. That was all that was out and I listened to it and honestly the thing that made me fall in love with it was the Rototoms. This is the best use of Rototoms I have heard in the longest times.

01:52:10.860 --> 01:52:40.660
And what I'm realizing is that rototoms are the new sax for me in 2021 because there is a lack of sax out there. Even my main sax. Hey, Rivers of Niles coming. Just wait. Coming. That first track lacked sax. Okay. When you're a sax addict like myself, you need sax. And there was no sax on that. So. Well, anything made them, I'll just interject for a second here. I listened to, I think there was like one track like you listened to or two tracks. And I immediately bought the vinyl because it just, it really,

01:52:40.900 --> 01:52:43.080
spoke to me like that and I don't do that normally.

01:52:43.480 --> 01:52:45.200
And I went to go buy it and I saw your icon.

01:52:45.300 --> 01:52:46.600
I was like, oh, okay, we're cool.

01:52:46.760 --> 01:52:47.300
I'm in the right area.

01:52:48.480 --> 01:52:50.840
This isn't like a one night stand.

01:52:52.860 --> 01:52:58.820
Next for me is just because of reading the deal book, you know, it's I read at night before I go to bed.

01:52:58.940 --> 01:53:03.180
And so the hardest thing about that is like what I'm reading is I want to be listening to it.

01:53:03.320 --> 01:53:09.040
So elf, rainbow, you know, a lot of this started, Jay.

01:53:09.120 --> 01:53:38.700
Like I said, when you wrote that article, I mean, I knew of Dio, I listened to Dio, I loved Dio, but just delving into some of his other things. I mean, I forgot how much I love those first three Rainbow albums. You know, and even to like one night when I watched the show Billions and the dude had the Rainbow Rising shirt on in the end of it. I can't remember if it was Tara Wilman or Stargazer that was like in the closing credits. I was like, I fucking know this. I would argue, I honestly think Rainbow Rising is one of the formative,

01:53:39.120 --> 01:54:09.100
European style heavy metal albums. Like it really is because that came out like 70. Yeah. But it's one of the ones that really kind of has that. So guitar harmonies on it moves along at a more heavy metal Euro heavy metal pace. Well, I've been doing this thing. So in our new house, we have some bike trails and I use these bike trails to get to breweries and I put tunes on when I'm going and I put Stargazer or I was listening to rising and then Stargazer came on and then I put Stargazer on again and then I put it on again. And like, I'm trying to think about what I'm going to do.

01:54:09.140 --> 01:54:39.020
I may have looked like as I was biking. Cause I'm like, I literally like, I see a rainbow rising, you know, looking at people and doing all these things. And I thought this is like, this is what that music is all about and why I love it. You get arrested if there's kids on that trail. Yeah. Unfortunately there wasn't. I was like, I was like biking through a garden before we're working about their vegetables, which of course brings us back to carcass. Rainbows over here. You're growing carcass over there. I don't know about you guys, but like, there are,

01:54:39.140 --> 01:55:09.100
some days I'm actually too lazy to choose music so I let a computer do it for me and so Spotify has this list called Rewind so one day I tried it out right first four or five tracks yes this is what I've been listening to and then like the next 20 minutes is like shit I haven't listened to in like five six years totally got back into nails like you will never one of us came on and I was like oh shit I forgot how much I love these guys and so it just threw more and more of that at me I feel like they're

01:55:09.100 --> 01:55:12.200
Probably more in the power violence category than like a grindcore, but

01:55:12.960 --> 01:55:15.060
really dug that and just a lot of other stuff.

01:55:16.440 --> 01:55:22.740
Jay, you mentioned something earlier that was also one of the things that kept coming, you know, and it's sometimes it's just nice to just randomly get fed this shit.

01:55:24.360 --> 01:55:28.000
Another band album, Erdve, Savangalia.

01:55:29.140 --> 01:55:32.440
That's my Lithuanian post-metal band. I'm still listening to that a lot. Love it.

01:55:33.060 --> 01:55:36.880
And also, last thing for me, post-interview with Hannes.

01:55:37.760 --> 01:55:43.420
John and I just didn't know how much Honest Grossman was involved in beyond

01:55:44.380 --> 01:55:47.540
some of the obvious ones. So I've been with his solo albums,

01:55:49.160 --> 01:55:55.940
Moral Collapse. What's the other one I'm not thinking of, John? Did you finally listen to Alkaloid? Yes, that's the one. Thank you.

01:55:56.500 --> 01:56:03.440
Well, Matt bought like everything on Bandcamp because I saw it. I was just clicking buttons. I didn't have my eyes open on this. Click, click, click, click, click, click.

01:56:04.520 --> 01:56:34.440
So just click the buy it all. Honest camp 3000. Exactly. He didn't realize when he clicked the buy it all on Honest's page was like 472 albums. No shit. Honest was so awesome. Like you don't, I got him. We don't know this. I want to get Honest. The reason I want to get Honest on the cast. Cause I know how much John loves him. Obvious. I love his stuff too, but I knew how much John loves him, but to have him on the cast and have him be that cool and that much fun to talk to. It's just like icing on the cake, man.

01:56:34.520 --> 01:57:03.980
That's so cool. Yeah. And FYI, John and Marcus and I, we're from the future. Yeah. Yes. If you have a Blackberry, you can find it. All right. John, give us your, that's it for me. Give us your, what you're listening to. Okay. So we already mentioned between the Berry to me and it's just weird for me to say that because I never really listened to him, but I kind of liked this new album. So I've been digging through their catalog, but I have been listening to the new one, but we've already mentioned them.

01:57:04.520 --> 01:57:34.480
A Band Called Burial in the Sky that consumed itself. They are a progressive tech metal band out of Pennsylvania. I don't know what it is with me in tech death this year. I'm not a big fan, but for some reason I'm gravitating towards it. But what caught my attention, and Jay, this is for you, this song, you may not like the song, but there's something about it that you might like, and it's a song called Anatomy of Us. It's like a 12-minute song, but it opens up with this very pegs on a wing from Animals, like intro. So it's very acoustic, and

01:57:34.500 --> 01:58:04.480
It sounds like the vocal melodies are from that album. And then it just goes off the rails, you know, but it's actually pretty cool. So that's a pretty intro too, isn't it? Oh God. In and of itself, that should be a five minute beautiful acoustic song, but then they just throw it away and hit on. Yeah. Well, then they revisit it and I'm like, dude, that's just one song. Come on. Yeah, for sure. So again, I don't know why I'm listening so much tech death, but it's very proggy too. So that's what I kind of like about it. Well, I was just going to say that, Jen, I think some of

01:58:04.480 --> 01:58:34.320
This tech death stuff has a lot of prog elements into it. So they're giving you a little more color than what you're used to with tech death. At least that's how I feel. Yeah, I traditionally don't like it because I just get bored. But speaking of technical and like prog and avant-garde, it just off the fucking rails. The third album from Discord, The Generations, this album is insane. It really is. I mean, if you go and you listen to all the for fans of, it's just like, I say,

01:58:34.340 --> 01:58:35.200
for fans of cynic,

01:58:35.460 --> 01:58:35.540
atheist,

01:58:35.880 --> 01:58:36.420
void ceremony,

01:58:36.960 --> 01:58:37.760
Morbis Kron,

01:58:37.980 --> 01:58:38.080
uh,

01:58:38.660 --> 01:58:39.000
Demolich.

01:58:39.000 --> 01:58:39.200
I mean,

01:58:39.280 --> 01:58:40.140
it's just like crazy.

01:58:40.760 --> 01:58:40.960
It's,

01:58:41.500 --> 01:58:42.320
I don't know what I think about it.

01:58:42.320 --> 01:58:42.900
I like it a lot,

01:58:43.020 --> 01:58:43.540
but it's really,

01:58:43.960 --> 01:58:44.960
it's a lot to take in.

01:58:45.420 --> 01:58:46.360
There is a lot going on.

01:58:46.820 --> 01:58:47.220
Tons.

01:58:47.900 --> 01:58:48.180
Uh,

01:58:48.480 --> 01:58:50.760
another band I got off of a new music Friday.

01:58:50.860 --> 01:58:52.640
Somebody mentioned this existence void,

01:58:53.120 --> 01:58:57.900
a not mon black metal semi avant-gardeish album.

01:58:59.100 --> 01:58:59.180
I,

01:58:59.520 --> 01:59:01.240
somebody had mentioned it and I saw the album cover.

01:59:01.240 --> 01:59:01.480
I was like,

01:59:01.540 --> 01:59:31.260
I'm going to buy on the album cover. And I listened. I was like, wow, this is fucking great. And I haven't listened to too much black metal this year. And I'm digging out. So that'll probably actually end up on my list, I think. We've mentioned Fetid Zombie. Will, I wanted to ask you, do you know the dude from Fetid Zombie? Will. Will Sleepcake. Just a new logo for a droid. I know. I didn't know. I thought, I figured Will would know him because he's from, what,

01:59:31.400 --> 02:00:00.340
Leesburg, George? Is that what we figured out? Yeah, I think so. Somewhere out that way. And he's in a ton of bands, but he does all this artwork. I like that album, too. It was my album of the month. I will add to what Marcus said about it. There's also a very 80s prog metal sound to the guitar riffs, I thought. And there's some like semi-gothic metal, early 90s gothic metal. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not much, just a touch. I said to George, I said, wow, this album's all over the place.

02:00:02.300 --> 02:00:30.820
It's for some reason called an EP, but it's longer than most of his albums. Go figure. The next one has not been released yet, but I got my copy of it yesterday. It's the new Hooded Menace. You bastard. How is it, John? It's very cool. Is it a contender? I was going to be like, hey, this is my album of the month. And then I was kind of like, you know, I don't know. I'm trying to be Christopher Walken here, but it's not working.

02:00:32.320 --> 02:01:01.020
And then I was like, oh my god, oh my god, you know, Hooded Menace might be a contender. So I don't know. Oh my god. If you do that, George, you got to turn sideways and you have to kind of lift your shoulders a few times. I mean, there might be any cowbell because I got to have more cowbell. Well, there's a big ass bell on the cowbell. The songs have been released are great. Yeah. But John's listened to the whole thing. So it is definitely, it doesn't sound like Trouble, but it has Trouble's format, which is the

02:01:01.080 --> 02:01:01.780
kind of heavy,

02:01:02.310 --> 02:01:04.020
twin guitar riff driven,

02:01:05.000 --> 02:01:05.620
but with doom.

02:01:06.380 --> 02:01:07.380
It's still death doom,

02:01:07.940 --> 02:01:10.940
but it's definitely more upbeat and it's sound.

02:01:11.840 --> 02:01:12.960
So don't every album,

02:01:12.990 --> 02:01:14.580
they change the death doom that they do.

02:01:14.650 --> 02:01:15.900
They do funeral doom one album.

02:01:15.950 --> 02:01:17.060
Then they do straight death doom.

02:01:17.180 --> 02:01:17.420
This one,

02:01:17.460 --> 02:01:21.000
they've added some more color with kind of more heavy metal riffs.

02:01:21.260 --> 02:01:21.520
It's good.

02:01:21.970 --> 02:01:22.420
I like it.

02:01:23.360 --> 02:01:23.980
That's out Friday.

02:01:25.280 --> 02:01:25.960
I got two more,

02:01:26.570 --> 02:01:27.620
one that Markisan,

02:01:27.620 --> 02:01:28.560
and I know he likes,

02:01:28.640 --> 02:01:30.200
but I don't know how much he likes this one.

02:01:30.260 --> 02:02:00.220
because they didn't mention it and that's new lantlos win hunt oh i do love that i like it i don't know if it's not as much as the last one yeah and i don't know if it'll make my list because it's not really necessarily metal anymore it's more kind of rock and post metalish post rock shoegazy and um it's not metal enough to make my list john and it's not as good as melting sun which no but it's good my all-time favorites it's very good i do really quite like it though it's very bright and i think that speaks to where he is in his life which is cool you know

02:02:00.240 --> 02:02:30.140
It's not the Lantlose of 15 years ago, if that's what you're looking for. That's for sure. I mean, I, and I like that he's doing something different, you know, I don't need the same album every single time, you know, but of course I'm, I don't know anything's going to live up to Melting Sun. Yeah. But, but I would, I would have preferred if he still was doing something like Melting Sun though. And then the last one we already mentioned, Wolves in the Throne Room. I'm liking it. I don't know how much I like it compared to the other stuff, but I, I do like it a lot and well done. Galen.

02:02:30.280 --> 02:03:00.220
I'm being part of that. That's very cool. Nice. Hey, Will. So I'm going to do this real quick. So Dan Clancher. Clancher. He sent me this album. Cripcrawler. Justin's into that too. Yeah, yeah. The album name is Future Absurdivant.

02:03:00.800 --> 02:03:29.740
It's pretty good. It's death metal. I love it. Then there's a band from Perth, Australia, which I've been to, which kind of like, imagine if, I'm trying to think of like an appropriate, kind of like, if all the people, imagine if Los Angeles was like one 20th the size of people, but in the location completely surrounded by nothing on the West Coast.

02:03:30.240 --> 02:04:00.120
From the United States. That's Perth, Australia. And it's a band called Ashen. And they're new. It's pretty much an EP called Godless Oath. Check it out. It's really awesome. I've been listening to the Fetid Zombie. We talk about the Fulci. And I've been listening to the Crescent. Carving the Fires of Octet. I don't have my glasses on. Close enough. Yeah. The new Temple of Dread.

02:04:00.260 --> 02:04:30.220
which is like obituary worship but i think they moved on from that a little bit and i think they're finding their own groove which is really nice so if you did not check them out the last time the new album is called hades unleashed um and yeah that's kind of it and car cast that's yeah all right i'll be quick on my list carcass first and foremost has probably been spinning more than anything else uh we got the

02:04:30.220 --> 02:05:00.040
for the new Worm Witch, who I've liked the last few records. I'm still making my mind up about this one. It's not a huge departure, but they're always a little different from release to release. I went back and have revisited a couple of times the last Metal Church album with Mike Howe on it, just as a kind of honor the man kind of thing. I'm assuming before I got on, you guys talked about Mike Howe, right? Yep, we did. Yep. Yeah. I have been listening to everybody's albums of the month, Fetid Zombie,

02:05:00.220 --> 02:05:30.200
probably the biggest one that would have been for consideration for me had I not gone with Craven Idol which I've also been listening to and then I'm always listening to older stuff I seem to have listened to Scorpions Tokyo tapes five times in the last three weeks for some reason that's a older Scorpions live album and yeah I'll just leave it there a bunch of random stuff too I also made a point of listening to both of the Thunderdome albums a couple of times this week to make sure I was on the

02:05:30.240 --> 02:05:59.860
Hey, this reminds me, how's your band doing? You've been playing lately. Yeah. We got a new drummer. I could officially say now, which was pretty cool. My head is off to Sergey because I'm lazy and he's not. He posted on Craigslist a few times to see if we could get somebody. And we had one guy. Tried to get a hooker, ended up with a drummer. Had got ahold of one guy who ended up just being a lot of hot air. And then we got this guy who's a jazz drummer and he is bringing the sickest weird shit to the table.

02:06:00.780 --> 02:06:29.880
And this is a change for him, but he sought us out based on our, and so we're playing right now every week and he's still learning the record and we're writing new stuff and everything. So that's fantastic. Jay. I'm really excited. I was telling George and maybe you, you, I can't remember if you were here, but I hadn't seen Sergei since the pandemic started. So it was also a real treat to just be in the same room with him again. And if you've never played in front of a half stack or a stack,

02:06:30.880 --> 02:07:00.100
that's hard to replace with a bedroom amp. So when you get to do that again, make your knees shake a little bit, that's a very satisfying experience. So yeah. We're moving forward. We're not a lost cause. And I should also mention is doing his moonlighting in a band I've pitched to you guys once or twice called War Troll, a good friend of ours. Oh yeah. I like War Troll. They actually wear masks and stuff. And Sergei is just playing keyboards in the band and he wears like a kind of Sun O hood when he plays. They got to play one show before new,

02:07:00.240 --> 02:07:30.160
Regulations hit us again. But I would really recommend the last Warchal record. This guy, Adam Miskich, who's the head of the band, is a good songwriter. I really like it. You recommended it before, and I totally got into it. Good stuff. I think it's great. Well, they're working on their second record, so it's nice to just be out at this rehearsal studio again. There's not many of us left. I really did wipe some bands out, and Warchal's the only band there now that I even know, and then there's a bunch of empty rooms, man. You're so talented, Jay. I'm really excited to hear some new songs.

02:07:30.220 --> 02:07:33.220
I'm glad that you're practicing with a new band.

02:07:35.000 --> 02:07:36.500
You're too kind, but I will say this.

02:07:36.720 --> 02:07:38.420
I've been playing guitar like a crazy person.

02:07:38.620 --> 02:07:44.080
And my solo plane has come along like I am a whole different guitar player now.

02:07:44.440 --> 02:07:46.840
And I play every day for as long as I can.

02:07:46.860 --> 02:07:47.380
So, yeah.

02:07:48.020 --> 02:07:49.860
Still working on those Randy Rose cellars too, by the way.

02:07:50.160 --> 02:07:50.540
Excellent.

02:07:50.840 --> 02:07:51.120
Excellent.

02:07:51.700 --> 02:07:52.780
Oh, fuck that guy, by the way.

02:07:52.820 --> 02:07:53.480
He was really good.

02:07:56.060 --> 02:07:56.700
Make you cry.

02:07:58.280 --> 02:08:28.240
And that's I pretty much got my list out. And then there's a lot of random stuff. I'm like, Matt, I'll sometimes just put shuffle and see where it leads me. And I obviously put a bunch of stuff on the water I put every week. And that's a big part of listening. But constantly listening. Thank God for the new carcass is finally upon us. Oh, it's so good. I mean, thanks, Abe. Yeah, that's right. Hand it off to you, Georgie. Alrighty. I've been listening to all kinds of stuff that's not metal, but I, in terms of metal, I've got a mere four.

02:08:28.300 --> 02:08:57.719
four albums for you one of which has been mentioned first up i thought Markisan was going to say this one but alchemy of flesh ageless abominations their first album their georgia death metal band next up john like my metal friday i think right i think i had it mindless yeah i think so uh next up john i think mentioned this one discord with a k degenerations third album norwegian death metal uh i listened to that one based on i think

02:08:57.740 --> 02:09:27.700
Justin or I know Justin likes it. That's probably where I got it. Third album, Laceration. I found this one all on my own because they put out a compilation a couple years ago of like all their old stuff. So this is their first real full length album called Demise. And they're a California death thrash band and they rip. It really does rip. It does. And my last and fourth and

02:09:27.740 --> 02:09:56.920
The final album, a band called Ossuary, which is not a band that has been on here before because, but there's like Ossuaryum or something. I thought this was that band, so I listened to it and I was like, oh, it's not that band because this is, but this is their third album called Addicted to Human Flesh. They're a Colombian death metal band. Well, not bad, George. I thought you were going to mention like Billie Eilish or something like that.

02:09:57.020 --> 02:10:26.880
Not man. So I, I, yeah, I listened to all kinds of not metal stuff recently lately, but I didn't put it on here. So are you, are you back on a metal path? My friend, you got to get back. I mean, I am the last half of the year. I'm just, I'm just open to all things. Let's put it that way. I mean, you know, when I work out, I'm definitely doing death metal or something of that nature. But so, which reminds me, I forgot to say,

02:10:27.000 --> 02:10:56.980
I have gone back to Pig Destroyer again. So, Pig Destroyer is a big part of my listening to, and I'm speaking to that. You should work out to Pig Destroyer to get some shit down there with George. So, here we are at the ultimate end of the episode, Metal Thunderdome. Jay, take it away. All right. So, you know, I had my primary motivation on the albums I chose was, I knew this was going to be the episode with Hannah Skroupsman on it, and he's

02:10:57.000 --> 02:11:26.640
I think he's involved in a lot of proggy stuff. I would call him a prog drummer. But I wanted to go back to the 80s when prog metal was still somewhat in its infancy. There were some things happening out there, but it wasn't into some of the strange scapes we've gotten to today in a good way. Anyway, so I selected Iron Maiden's Seventh Son of a Seventh Son versus Queensryche Operation Mindcrime. Now, the more obvious choice,

02:11:27.000 --> 02:11:28.000
Rage for Order.

02:11:28.520 --> 02:11:29.520
Rage for Order, excuse me.

02:11:31.300 --> 02:11:32.740
That would have changed things.

02:11:33.500 --> 02:11:33.900
Wait, what?

02:11:34.400 --> 02:11:35.560
It would have changed things.

02:11:36.720 --> 02:11:36.940
Really?

02:11:37.320 --> 02:11:38.220
Would it have changed things?

02:11:38.420 --> 02:11:38.600
No.

02:11:38.780 --> 02:11:39.280
For some of us.

02:11:39.920 --> 02:11:46.820
I did just misspeak there, but it was because I think Operation Mankind would have been the more obvious choice to put up against this record.

02:11:47.000 --> 02:11:47.200
Yes.

02:11:47.480 --> 02:11:48.000
Seventh Son.

02:11:48.260 --> 02:11:50.740
For one thing, they were released within a month of each other.

02:11:51.380 --> 02:12:21.000
And I actually remember at the time, this is true, remembering they had set out to make Seventh Son of a Seventh Son a concept record, which it very much is not because they gave up on it. So that, so like 60% now they did. Trust me, research it. It's a concept record. It is, but not every song is about the concept. They gave up on it at some point. So, and Bruce always regretted that. And I read an interview with Bruce at the time that said, we set out to do this and then we got lazy. And he said, and then I remember this and I love this quote. He said,

02:12:22.100 --> 02:12:26.840
And I was like, well, there goes the fucking neighborhood. Because he felt Queens, Queens,

02:12:26.920 --> 02:12:51.320
Rick had stepped up and done what they had attempted to do. Now, I honestly thought, so, so, but then I started to think about Prague along the terms of technology, which both of these records embraced some technology that was not common in heavy metal at the time. So I could have gone several ways here. One was Maiden really got introduced to technology when they did somewhere in time, which is the previous record. And so I was going to,

02:12:54.239 --> 02:13:18.300
and I thought well somewhere in time will win hands down. So then I thought well it makes more sense to do Operation Mein Kime versus Seventh Son but then I thought Operation Mein Kime kind of would have somewhat the unfair advantage there and even though will I hear your distaste for it. So then I thought no. So Seventh Son does not have as much technology as

02:13:20.280 --> 02:13:48.280
As Somewhere in Time does on it. They kind of were stepping away, but still got the guitar synth stuff on it. And Rage for Order was Queensryche's first attempt at technology stuff that they added to it. So I think they have about the same amount of that in them. And they're also both almost concept records, because Seventh Son is not the complete concept they wanted to do, and Rage for Order is primarily about technology, but not uniquely. Not every song is that way. So I'm going to call them both 50%

02:13:49.040 --> 02:14:17.920
with technology that was not commonly used in heavy metal at the time. Perhaps I overthought it. I apologize. But and I also think that Rage for Order is Queensryche high watermark personally, even above Operation Minecraft. So with that, I'll release it to the dogs. And I'm pretty sure you're all just going to say Seventh Son and I'll go cry in the corner. Okay, Mark is on. Say it. Well, I'm first of all, I have to say, Jay, I like that you put all that thought into it. I had the similar thoughts when you put this out.

02:14:17.960 --> 02:14:25.380
and I listened to him and I really appreciate you explaining it. We got Hannes to answer this metal

02:14:25.620 --> 02:14:47.640
Thunderdome just so you know. So that'll be in there. I've told you that but it's in there. Actually before you go then can I say one more thing? It is simply that one the other thing was Rage for Order most of the technology in that record is drum based and so I honestly thought Hannes would appreciate that. There are some keyboards but a lot of those weird sounds are produced by the drummer. Yeah. Yeah well I'll just save it.

02:14:47.660 --> 02:15:16.780
You'll see what Hannah says, but we made sure we got him to make his pick. And he actually had a detailed reason for why he picked what he picked, which was cool. So for me, I thought when you made this pick, it would be an incredibly easy choice for me because like most of us, I'm a huge maiden fan. In fact, Jay actually mailed me his extra final copy of Seventh Son, I believe last year because he had one.

02:15:17.060 --> 02:15:46.820
So I got a kick out of spinning the LP that you sent me, Jay. That was really cool. Not that I didn't have it spun a million times. Your copy of Rage for Order is in the mail right now. I'm going to hold you to that. So Seven of Sun is a good record. It's not on my high all-time maiden list. I may have talked about this with John, actually. It's not on my high... It's pretty low, actually, on my maiden list. But I love that it

02:15:46.840 --> 02:16:16.260
I thought it was their first concept album, but apparently it's their first attempt at a concept album. And the progressive elements were interesting that they added, you know, above what they had done in their previous record. And I believe that Bruce had more of an active role in co-writing the lyrics with Steve Harris, which is also cool. In contrast, I am not that much of a Queensryche fan. I don't even remember ever listening.

02:16:16.840 --> 02:16:46.820
to Rage for Order. I don't think I've ever listened to this record, but I know that Rage was a move into more progressive metal, and Jay just confirmed that in his description of it after their first record, The Warning. So, all that said, it comes as a very great surprise to me. Jay, you thought that everybody was going to pick Maiden. I am choosing Rage for Order. I think that Seventh Son is going to

02:16:46.880 --> 02:17:15.540
this record overall on the cast and probably with our listeners. But I really like the mix of glam, of progressive metal, of hard rock on Rage for Order. It's got a groove to it. It's got a swagger to it that I didn't expect. The solos and the melodies are great. I think that Jeff Tate shows the fuck off on this record.

02:17:16.240 --> 02:17:45.380
He's got a range of vocals that goes from more aggressive than I've ever heard him, but he also delivers that fucking nighttime Tate sexiness. And so for me, the songs on Rage for Order also really stick in my head a lot more than the Maiden record. Now, part of this... For listening so closely, because I think that... I really did.

02:17:47.039 --> 02:18:15.240
I think part of the reason for this bit could be because this record is new to me right I don't even know if I ever listen to it could be a brand new jam for me that I've ever spun and I've spun Seventh Son a hundred times maybe but I have to go with my ears and my gut on this and my my auditory belly says Queensryche and that's what I'm going with

02:18:15.840 --> 02:18:16.160
Awesome.

02:18:16.559 --> 02:18:16.760
All right.

02:18:17.059 --> 02:18:18.200
That's what I would hope for.

02:18:18.420 --> 02:18:19.840
People not that you would go with that record,

02:18:20.519 --> 02:18:22.480
but I think there's something special in this Rage for a record,

02:18:22.599 --> 02:18:23.360
or a record.

02:18:23.519 --> 02:18:25.280
And I knew I was putting it up against the Goliath,

02:18:25.440 --> 02:18:26.040
but there it is.

02:18:26.320 --> 02:18:28.059
And that's the thing that I like about this pick,

02:18:28.240 --> 02:18:28.340
Jay.

02:18:28.400 --> 02:18:32.120
I had never listened to it and I was like fuck this is this is not even a good

02:18:32.269 --> 02:18:58.380
fucking pick fuck Jay what's he doing what's he even doing this is stupid and then I listened to it and now I completely changed my mind because I listened to it and I really like this record and I think that maybe the best Thunderdome for me ever personally awesome awesome Matt I'll give the floor to Matt so I agree like this this is a fabulous Thunderdome and that's what I like about the Thunderdome the Thunderdome when you guys choose them

02:18:58.380 --> 02:19:27.639
They're far more interesting than when I choose them. Especially when it's stuff that I'm not super exposed to. I mean, most of my Maiden stuff has been retrospective. So an album like Seven Sun is probably my number three Maiden album. I love it so much. But when it comes to, you know, my first Queen Drake stuff was the, I want to say the Empire album. But as I was pushed to look back, it was always to Operation Mindcrime.

02:19:27.880 --> 02:19:57.520
and I had maybe spun Rage for Water once. It wasn't, you know, it wasn't super exposed to it. Strangely enough, in 2019, I was at this kind of, it was like an 80s hair metal festival. But Queensryche was also there. So they played live. I was totally, I mean, granted they have a new singer, but man, I was totally blown away by their music. So they definitely opened my mind to things beyond Empire and side of lucidity and things of that nature. I remember you talking about that. Yeah, it was a good time.

02:19:57.680 --> 02:20:26.600
about it or whatever. Yeah. Like this album is super awesome. Um, I mean, at the end of the day, I have to go with Iron Maiden, but it's not by much. I'm so intrigued by, by Rage for Water. The song that sticks in my head the most is, is it called Close to You or Closer to You? Yeah. Close to You. When you listen to it, like, I literally thought I was listening to an old school ministry song, the way the drum beats start out. So to your point, Shane, the technology about the drums.

02:20:26.700 --> 02:20:56.480
And I realized because, you know, you mentioned this a couple weeks ago, so we've had time to think about it. And like those, those, some of those Rage for Water songs are in my head because I went to listen to it again the other day. Like, oh shit, that's what was in my head. Like, I really dig that song. So at the very least, Jay, I thank you for opening my eyes to a really phenomenal album. Awesome. Yeah. Very cool. Yeah. But go fuck yourself, Iron Maiden. No, hey, it's not, I'm not calling this a Sophie.

02:20:56.760 --> 02:21:02.180
I like that it was hard for some of you so far and I thought was the whole point yeah yeah all right

02:21:03.520 --> 02:21:09.460
John uh before I start Matt I will point out that the song you mentioned is actually not a Queensryche song as a cover

02:21:11.460 --> 02:21:26.680
so I'm gonna say it's a ministry cover no uh so I'll start off by saying admittedly I am not a super fan of either one of these albums um I'm not a big seven son fan at all and I've never not said that

02:21:26.700 --> 02:21:56.660
I've always been pretty strong on that. I like it, but there's something about it that just has never clicked with me in the past. But I set that aside and I wanted to give it a real fair shake because I've listened to it a ton of times, but I don't go back to it often. And I think the same could be said for Rage Forwarder. I like it, but I never really spent a lot of time with it. You know, I like Queensryche. And my initial thought was that this would be a killing too, because they're both legacy bands, but Maiden's Legacy is much more

02:21:56.700 --> 02:21:58.240
more regarded obviously than Queensry.

02:21:58.980 --> 02:22:00.480
Cause Queensryche has put out a lot of,

02:22:00.840 --> 02:22:01.300
a lot of crap.

02:22:01.940 --> 02:22:02.060
Yeah.

02:22:02.240 --> 02:22:03.400
I'll be the first to say that.

02:22:03.600 --> 02:22:03.780
Um,

02:22:03.900 --> 02:22:04.080
yeah.

02:22:04.490 --> 02:22:04.840
I mean,

02:22:05.320 --> 02:22:06.160
promised land is,

02:22:06.640 --> 02:22:08.360
and that's the cutoff right there.

02:22:08.880 --> 02:22:09.280
And it's,

02:22:09.440 --> 02:22:09.860
that's back.

02:22:09.950 --> 02:22:10.960
And that was a long time ago.

02:22:13.260 --> 02:22:13.960
Don't get me wrong.

02:22:14.300 --> 02:22:17.180
It's not like made has been putting out blast beaters,

02:22:17.630 --> 02:22:17.860
you know,

02:22:18.440 --> 02:22:19.020
for a while.

02:22:19.070 --> 02:22:19.340
I mean,

02:22:19.720 --> 02:22:21.600
there's mixed results in the last few albums too.

02:22:22.540 --> 02:22:24.140
And they had a middle period that was a little iffy,

02:22:24.300 --> 02:22:24.420
but,

02:22:25.030 --> 02:22:25.120
uh,

02:22:25.340 --> 02:22:55.020
I wanted to separate myself from all of that and treat these as if they were separate entities from the bands they were part of. And while I came away liking both albums a lot more, I still cannot get into Seven Son that much. Although I do like songs like The Evil of Men Do. I think that's a great song. And I came away liking The Prophecy even more than I did before. I don't know what it is. I like that song a lot. But Marcus Untouched on something.

02:22:55.360 --> 02:22:55.740
that's,

02:22:56.560 --> 02:22:57.800
Queensryche has more earworms.

02:22:58.670 --> 02:22:59.340
It just does.

02:22:59.680 --> 02:23:00.380
It really does.

02:23:00.800 --> 02:23:04.600
And it's a front loaded album and it's a back loaded album for me.

02:23:07.060 --> 02:23:08.340
The whisper is just awesome.

02:23:08.430 --> 02:23:09.800
I think I love that song.

02:23:11.620 --> 02:23:13.220
And so it's close,

02:23:13.680 --> 02:23:18.300
but I went with Queensryche and I was going to add that I was going with it

02:23:18.480 --> 02:23:19.640
because I was going to J this.

02:23:20.500 --> 02:23:21.840
And I figured why not fuck it up?

02:23:22.160 --> 02:23:23.080
I'm not letting them go out.

02:23:23.320 --> 02:23:25.060
It's coming down to fucking Hannes.

02:23:25.100 --> 02:23:53.280
And you guys know what it is and I don't. I thought Sean would be the only one that I'd get. Yeah. And but I telling you the truth, I honestly gave both albums a fair shake. I spent a lot of time with seven sun and I do like it a lot more. But for me, I think it's and I think this probably speaks a lot to Will's opinion on this. You came in, I think, around that heavily for me. If I'm not mistaken, that was your period more. My period was made in Japan back in 1981.

02:23:53.280 --> 02:24:23.260
So I think for me, I got to the point where I was like, I've heard this before. Even though it's very innovative and it's creative for them and it's different. But some of it I've heard before. And so maybe that's part of it. Maybe I hadn't heard Rage before, you know, or Queensryche. But, you know, it's close. But I went with Rage. It's close. Yeah, for sure. All right. I'm glad I can surprise you, Jay. You thought that maybe John was going to give you this. Well, it's not that you just surprised me, but you

02:24:23.300 --> 02:24:53.260
You kind of spoke a lot of my own thoughts back to me, which I really appreciate. Yeah. Excellent. All right. Well, I take these fucking things to heart for sure. Yeah, yeah, for sure. We all do. Yeah. Well, I him and hall about this for about a nanosecond. Then I picked that up. At least you were fair. Give it a chance. I'll have to. I will 100% admit I never even heard of rage for order. I know Operation Mindcrime because they open up

02:24:54.581 --> 02:25:22.860
And I want to say I maybe had a copy of that album. And, you know, and I liked some of the songs on it, but it just wasn't what I was into at the time. I was into like Master of Puppets. And I've said famously many times on this podcast that Seven Son is probably my favorite maiden album.

02:25:23.300 --> 02:25:52.820
And not because it was my wheelhouse. Not to correct you, John, I will just reinvent the history that, you know, I got into Iron Maiden in the third album. Number of the Beast. Number of the Beast, yes. Oh, okay. I thought that your coming of age was a little later on. No, no, no, no. Like, I can actually document when I became a metalhead because I was 10 years old and I heard Number of the Beast.

02:25:52.860 --> 02:26:22.380
And I was like, this is it. But there's something about Seven Sun that I, to me, it was, and what was weird is I did learn something tonight when Jay said, like, it was a concept album, but it really wasn't. They got lazy because I always thought it was a contest album. I thought it was, this is dark. Like the, like, you know, you have, you have number of the beasts and everything is dark, but like this all the way through, it was like this occult.

02:26:22.860 --> 02:26:50.360
sort of darkness to a moon child seven sun you know maybe not quite the evil that men do but like there was there was like and you had the beginning you had the beginning intro and you had then the outro and it was sort of like it wrapped it all together for me anyway i love that album the synthesizers withstanding or notwithstanding whatever you say um i really like that album i've never heard rage for i did listen to it and i was sort of like

02:26:52.159 --> 02:26:54.700
I have to admit I was kind of like I'm wasting my time like

02:26:55.660 --> 02:27:18.641
you know it's stated at this point without question yeah but it like it was just more of I've never heard of it before I listened to it I I I came in with an open mind but that's like saying like hey I'm gonna put up master of puppets against you know some album you never heard of before that came out about the same year totally yeah yeah

02:27:18.660 --> 02:27:48.600
If you love Seventh Son, it's like one of your favorites. It's hard to get something else up against it that you've never heard. Right, yeah. I've never heard of it. But I listen to it and, you know, it's all fine, fair enough. But not even close for me. Not even close, bud. So that means, so far we've got two operations. So it's one Seventh Son. It's three mind crimes versus two Seventh Son. It's going to be tied. There's no mind crimes, by the way.

02:27:48.660 --> 02:28:18.560
I do too, too. Right now. Okay. Two, too. Uh, George, do your worst. Well, actually you have to officially make your choice. You didn't. You got to make your choice. Okay. Okay. Well, um, I really appreciate the thoughtful comments and listening on your part. Um, I, I'll say this, John actually had some of my, both John and Markisan really represented. Well, all of you guys have so far. So I'll say a couple of things. One is this, um, I agree with John. I was an early maiden adopter. And so I,

02:28:18.640 --> 02:28:48.620
I honestly kind of felt like Seven of the Sun was the first one where the air was coming out of the tires a little bit I thought it was a little long-winded I still thought it was good but I maybe John said it better which is like I've heard this before and it was the first time I got a maiden record when I wasn't like super fucking excited after I listened to it but it's good and so take that with a grain of salt and it's hard to describe this now though most most of you are old enough to know this but at that moment at least for those of us who were like kind of in the know on metal and stuff

02:28:48.640 --> 02:29:18.020
Great White Hope for like three records. Like here was this first band that came along that really sounded like a European metal band with the exception of the underground stuff. And The Warning is a great example of that. That's something that comes out of the Priest or Maiden catalog, you know, or sort of like that. And then they took this brave step and that didn't totally change, but just added all this technology. And I also think it's a super dark record. I think it's almost spooky in places like London, the song London.

02:29:19.880 --> 02:29:23.820
My favorite song on the record, probably my favorite Queensryche song is called Noia Regal.

02:29:24.100 --> 02:29:33.920
That's on there. New Religion. And then there's just this really thoughtful, the whole thing is about kind of bumping up against technology and yet they're kind of making it their bitch in this album.

02:29:34.080 --> 02:29:45.400
So that's kind of cool too. Screaming into Digital, I would call to mind. Chemical Youth, Noia Regal's New Religion that's talking about, I mean, it was like they were talking about cell phones before we got to cell phones or smartphones.

02:29:46.020 --> 02:29:48.420
Now all that's stated, I also just think it's catchy as fuck.

02:29:48.580 --> 02:30:18.480
It's a total heavy metal record. I mean, it's not at all like The Warning. Like I said, for a while, these guys were the Great White Hope. And they kind of lost me after Operation Mindcrime. But I would put them in the group of bands that we talk about, like Mastodon and others, where it's just sort of like, those first four were so good, man, you know, and I just wish, kind of thing. And the final thing I'll say about it is that this was actually,

02:30:19.339 --> 02:30:48.560
I honestly thought if you guys heard this record and listened to it honestly you'd be like holy fuck this is a great record and that was part of my motivation I didn't even say that much about the main record except to say I think infinite dreams is a high point for maiden that's a great fucking song there's a lot of really good songs on that record that whole thing is based on the Crowley stuff and all that stuff and to be honest with you I'm the big seller of chemical wedding Bruce accomplished in chemical wedding what they had set out to do in seventh son so that's Bruce

02:30:48.620 --> 02:31:18.560
and they really did just kind of like they got lazy and walked away from it before they finished it um so i think here's this young upstart band who's kind of hitting hard and another band who's kind of dominated the field um that stated uh rage ford or i i go with i i think it's a lost um it's an important lost honestly classic to me you know and i'm not even that i'm not a big queen's reg salesman you know what i mean like i get it if you don't like them right whoever you are but i think this is a special

02:31:18.580 --> 02:31:20.620
record and I honestly like it better than Operation Minecraft.

02:31:22.279 --> 02:31:24.160
I do. I think it's my favorite

02:31:24.400 --> 02:31:26.420
Queen's Ark record because you brought it up.

02:31:26.480 --> 02:31:28.380
I don't know if I would ever listen to it, but

02:31:28.780 --> 02:31:29.880
it's by far my favorite.

02:31:31.520 --> 02:31:33.220
Jay, I'll add one thing to what you said, Jay.

02:31:33.280 --> 02:31:34.600
I think their first three releases

02:31:35.479 --> 02:31:37.380
includes the EP or Forgotten Albums.

02:31:37.540 --> 02:31:39.440
Includes the EP, which by the way, that EP,

02:31:40.140 --> 02:31:42.100
I believe they recorded and then like Atlantic Records

02:31:42.320 --> 02:31:43.320
was like, we'll take it.

02:31:43.800 --> 02:31:43.920
Yeah.

02:31:44.480 --> 02:31:47.020
And then the warning was, is fucking really good too.

02:31:47.100 --> 02:31:48.400
You should listen to the warning, Marcus.

02:31:48.480 --> 02:32:18.460
It's not going to love it. It's fucking great. Oh, I've heard the warning. I listened to the warning. I have listened to the EP. I've listened to the other albums for some reason. I don't know where Rage for Order, why it got left out, but I just never really listened to it. You know, I think that I started with Queensryche because of like Silent Lucidity or something and went back, but for some reason never, never got that record. But Rage for Order to me is like a distillation of all the best

02:32:18.520 --> 02:32:19.780
elements of Queensry.

02:32:20.240 --> 02:32:21.080
Yeah, I totally agree.

02:32:21.240 --> 02:32:23.220
And the only other thing I'll say is this.

02:32:23.760 --> 02:32:26.380
I thought it was an extremely brave move that they made,

02:32:26.480 --> 02:32:27.200
and I thought it paid off.

02:32:27.560 --> 02:32:28.880
It's a lot different than the warning.

02:32:29.360 --> 02:32:29.840
It is.

02:32:29.930 --> 02:32:32.160
And I spent that whole summer listening to it.

02:32:32.430 --> 02:32:34.400
When it came out, I was just like, this is fucking amazing.

02:32:34.700 --> 02:32:35.040
Yeah.

02:32:36.520 --> 02:32:37.860
George, I hand it to you.

02:32:39.740 --> 02:32:42.020
I cannot deny my infinite dreams.

02:32:45.000 --> 02:32:46.540
I'm just going to go ahead and say Maiden.

02:32:48.320 --> 02:32:50.580
But then I will explain.

02:32:53.880 --> 02:32:56.600
You know, I mean, yeah, when you said this, I was like, duh.

02:32:58.861 --> 02:33:07.000
Because I've harbored a hatred for Rage for Order for 30 odd years or whatever.

02:33:08.780 --> 02:33:10.000
Though I am a Queensryche fan.

02:33:11.200 --> 02:33:14.420
I love Operation Mindcrime and Empire is okay.

02:33:18.160 --> 02:33:46.680
I had never actually listened to the entire album of Rage for Order until two days ago. I heard, I think it was like a dream in infrared or maybe it was Chemical Youth. I think that was a single. I think it was a single. And Screaming in Digital, I'd heard that. And I was like, this is fucking bullshit, whatever. But then when Mind Crime came out, I was like, oh, this is kind of cool. But I never went back and listened to Rage for Order.

02:33:47.260 --> 02:34:17.180
It was just stuck in my brain. This album sucks. And I'm not going to like it. So to be fair, two days ago, I went and I listened to the whole album. And it doesn't suck. It's actually pretty good. But it's a precursor to what, for me, Mindcrime will be. It's like, okay. Yes. And I'm like, all right. I see how they get from here to here to here.

02:34:17.240 --> 02:34:22.460
I get it and I'm like all right this doesn't suck in any way shape or form it does not I admit this

02:34:25.101 --> 02:34:47.220
but I listened to this two days ago I've been listening to Seventh Son for 30 years and it's one of my favorite albums by and it's not not close to being the favorite but it is you know it's really up there and there's just no way that something that I listened to today two days

02:34:47.220 --> 02:35:15.940
days ago can dethrone something like that. And to be fair, I'm listening to this thing and I'm going, you know, if I had given this a fair shot when it came out, things might be different. But have you noticed how, and I think maybe somebody said something about like the nostalgia factor. If I go back and listen to something from the eighties that I never heard when it came out, I'm like, this is dated.

02:35:16.880 --> 02:35:46.460
Ew. But I like so much stuff from the 80s that is fucking ew to people that like kids these days, you know, and it's like if a kid goes back, that's like, you know, 1820, whatever, and they go back and listen to something the 80s. And they're like, you know, I've heard this tears for fears. Yeah, well, no, it's just for fucking rule. But I know. I love tears for fears. Me too. But if you go back and listen to something like that, and you've never heard it before,

02:35:46.680 --> 02:35:51.560
you're like meh you know i've heard everything that came after that

02:35:52.240 --> 02:35:58.220
there's no you know this isn't this just doesn't do anything for me and i think that's why

02:35:58.340 --> 02:36:02.660
george i said it was the great white hope of that moment because i think i can speak for probably

02:36:02.940 --> 02:36:08.000
john and myself which is i started with queen's like at the ep like that was the first record i had

02:36:08.010 --> 02:36:13.921
and then i got them as they came out so so by that time then i was kind of an enthusiast sure you

02:36:13.920 --> 02:36:43.880
You know what I mean? And I get that. And not only that, but I was like, wow, look at this left turn they took. So yeah, I get that. But you're what you're saying makes sense. Yeah. And you know, cause I'll, I'll hear stuff now. I'm like, Oh, Hey, here's this band from the eighties that had never heard of. And if, and somebody is saying good stuff about it, let me go back and listen to it. And I'm like me, you know, yeah, whatever. It's okay. You know, I'd listen to it over Justin Bieber or some shit like that, but you know, it doesn't do anything for me. And I think it's, it's all a matter of the context of what you,

02:36:43.920 --> 02:36:48.380
you listen to in terms of things that are so old like this.

02:36:49.140 --> 02:36:49.240
Yeah.

02:36:49.980 --> 02:36:51.520
And the direction you came at it from.

02:36:51.700 --> 02:36:51.800
Yeah.

02:36:51.960 --> 02:36:52.660
And I,

02:36:53.000 --> 02:36:53.280
like I said,

02:36:54.240 --> 02:36:56.000
I've only ever heard the whole thing two days ago.

02:36:56.820 --> 02:37:01.240
It just can't compare to something that I've been adoring for decades.

02:37:01.820 --> 02:37:03.040
It's the exact same thing for me.

02:37:03.090 --> 02:37:04.240
And I went the opposite direction.

02:37:04.920 --> 02:37:05.060
Yeah.

02:37:05.220 --> 02:37:05.400
Well,

02:37:05.760 --> 02:37:07.200
obviously you're a better man than I.

02:37:08.600 --> 02:37:10.300
It helps if you can and you can't,

02:37:10.380 --> 02:37:13.320
but if you can go back in time and understood what it meant at the moment,

02:37:13.400 --> 02:37:43.160
I really can't stress that enough. Like Queensryche destroyed their legacy. They really did. And up until that moment and then on to Operation Mindcrime and slightly with Empire, they were like this kind of like great American heavy metal band that were honestly still almost kind of underground. You had to be kind of one of the weird brush nerds to like Queensryche. Yeah. In some sense. I freaking loved Mindcrime. I totally 180'd on that. It's like, I was like Rage for Order. Ooh, this sucks. And then Mindcrime came out and I was like, whoa, no, this, that was like, you know,

02:37:43.180 --> 02:37:45.440
If we'd done like a list that year, that would be my album of the year.

02:37:45.940 --> 02:37:46.220
You know?

02:37:46.400 --> 02:37:47.040
Yeah, for sure.

02:37:47.440 --> 02:37:48.100
Me too, I think.

02:37:48.540 --> 02:37:51.180
Though it did come out the same year as Master of Puppets, if I'm not mistaken.

02:37:51.660 --> 02:37:52.440
Okay, well, maybe not.

02:37:52.880 --> 02:37:54.720
But I will say this.

02:37:55.220 --> 02:37:56.280
But they opened that.

02:37:56.460 --> 02:37:58.180
They did that tour on Justice.

02:37:58.880 --> 02:37:59.320
And Justice.

02:37:59.640 --> 02:37:59.920
That's right.

02:38:00.080 --> 02:38:00.140
Yeah.

02:38:01.120 --> 02:38:01.980
Both of those facts are true.

02:38:03.439 --> 02:38:03.760
Confession.

02:38:03.940 --> 02:38:07.180
First time I had sex in high school was wearing an Operation Mine crime shirt.

02:38:09.500 --> 02:38:10.900
And it did not fare well.

02:38:11.140 --> 02:38:11.760
Let's just say that.

02:38:11.800 --> 02:38:15.880
It had a rough night

02:38:17.780 --> 02:38:19.460
Well, I appreciate the thoughtfulness

02:38:19.490 --> 02:38:20.080
I mean, I

02:38:21.100 --> 02:38:22.020
And I would say

02:38:22.190 --> 02:38:23.340
Let me just say to our audience

02:38:23.540 --> 02:38:25.060
If you've never listened to Rage for Order

02:38:25.160 --> 02:38:26.480
I highly suggest you do as much

02:38:26.640 --> 02:38:27.140
There's a

02:38:27.240 --> 02:38:28.720
It's a little bit of a lost metal classic

02:38:28.920 --> 02:38:29.740
That you might be glad

02:38:30.200 --> 02:38:31.300
To introduce into your life

02:38:32.040 --> 02:38:33.200
And I would say that too

02:38:33.380 --> 02:38:34.620
Like, because people are going to listen to this

02:38:34.660 --> 02:38:35.740
We're going to put up the poll

02:38:37.060 --> 02:38:37.640
Chances are

02:38:37.820 --> 02:38:39.420
You're going to try to vote for Maiden right away

02:38:39.620 --> 02:38:40.460
Because that's what you know

02:38:40.740 --> 02:38:41.780
But give

02:38:41.780 --> 02:39:11.320
Give Rage for Order a lesson. Because I did. I'm a huge Maiden fan. I never listened to Rage for Order. And it's my pick. And we're tied 3-3. And it's really interesting because Hannes gets to do the tiebreaker. And Matt, John, and I know. But we're not telling you what Hannes picked. All right. Here we are. End of the episode. Gentlemen, pick your albums of the episode. Indeed. Mark us on. Me first. Yeah.

02:39:11.780 --> 02:39:41.760
I feel like we've talked a lot about a lot of records on this episode but I'm gonna go as I usually do with a new record and it's Unrequited Beautiful Ghosts I think Unrequited is one of my favorite bands now I think the last record was amazing and it was very high on my year-end list so Beautiful Ghosts was one of my most anticipated releases of 2021

02:39:41.800 --> 02:40:11.760
We usually do an episode where we talk about most anticipated. We didn't this year. It would have been on there. It exceeded all my expectations. I think it delivers another phenomenal collection of songs without sounding like the last record. And it scales back that the more windswept epic qualities of Empathica in favor of a more personal, emotional soundscape. And to me, the best

02:40:11.800 --> 02:40:38.660
is the metal that makes me feel something. And I feel all the things listening to Beautiful Ghosts. So it's my album of the episode and it's going to be my album of August. So John, mark it down. That's an exclusive. It's, there's no way anything's going to top this one. We didn't see that coming. Nice.

02:40:41.780 --> 02:40:43.580
There you go. Locked.

02:40:44.060 --> 02:40:44.140
Roy.

02:40:45.720 --> 02:40:46.060
Matt.

02:40:46.640 --> 02:40:47.520
I'm in a dead tie.

02:40:48.620 --> 02:40:48.960
Ooh.

02:40:51.739 --> 02:40:52.700
Rainbow Rising.

02:40:53.520 --> 02:40:54.000
Oh, nice.

02:40:54.440 --> 02:40:55.760
And Mastodon's Leviathan.

02:40:57.060 --> 02:40:57.380
Whoa.

02:40:58.580 --> 02:41:00.180
It may not have been mentioned, but I...

02:41:00.860 --> 02:41:01.960
Just throwing it out there anyway.

02:41:01.980 --> 02:41:04.240
I feel like you mentioned it at some point.

02:41:05.060 --> 02:41:05.900
Or somebody did.

02:41:06.479 --> 02:41:06.960
Possibly.

02:41:07.840 --> 02:41:09.580
You mentioned it just so it would be in there.

02:41:09.640 --> 02:41:09.820
Wait, wait, are you making a pic?

02:41:10.040 --> 02:41:39.960
or bad? Or bad? Or bad? Or you're just telling us about your tie? It's just my tie. You gotta make a pick, dude. I see a rainbow rising, so I'll go with that. But pass it on to the life. You gotta go with Dio because we talk so much about Dio, I think. And a fine record, by the way. That's a good record. Nice. Run with the Wolves. Terrell Woman. Terrell Woman. So good. John? I actually picked three albums from my album of the month, but there's a reason. Just hear me out.

02:41:41.239 --> 02:42:09.780
I picked four. I took 27. I picked these three, and I didn't mean to single this person out, but he stood out the most for me, unfortunately, in our memoriam, and that was Eric Wagner. And I was going to suggest, if you don't know much about Trouble, to check out their first three albums. But I decided just now to go with one, and that is the second album, not the first, because everyone knows the first album. But I don't think enough people have listened to the second album, which is,

02:42:10.020 --> 02:42:37.800
just called The Skull. And it's an outstanding Doom album. It's even, I think, Doomier than the first album. So if you don't know much about them, and you heard us talking about him and his impact on early Doom, when it became a real genre, not just Sabbath and Pentagram, I would check out the album The Skull from Trouble. That's my album of the month. Or episode, which is also for the month, I guess, because we only do this once a month.

02:42:38.440 --> 02:43:08.040
I feel like I've been listening to so much Dio constantly because it's one of those things that my kids love listening to. I just feel like I can just say Dio every episode. But my album in the episode is there's a I mentioned earlier the band from Perth, Australia, Ashen. And they have an EP out called Godless Oath. It's not an album, but it's pretty short.

02:43:08.080 --> 02:43:37.460
But man, it's just great, straightforward death metal. A little melodic in some places, but Ashen, Godless Oath. Check it out. It's really great. Right on. All right. Well, I'm going to do one with an honorable mention. My album in the episode is going to be Carcass. I'm super excited about this record. I'm surprised Matt didn't go with that. It's the rainbow. Yeah, I know. You feel the rainbow. Taste the rainbow, man. It's been a lot of Skittles.

02:43:40.140 --> 02:44:07.900
He'll have more chances to honor that record as the year gets older. I'll pick Dio over Carcass any day. You should be playing my cut where they said, there's another rainbow right here. What are you doing? You're not on it, dude. I don't have it up. I can't get it up. My honorable mention was, even though you guys all spent the last week with it, I actually spent the last three weeks with it, I think, because it was the thing that prompted me to even remember it. I kind of put it on.

02:44:07.940 --> 02:44:37.040
And what I mean to say is it was awfully fun to walk in the shadows again with Rage for Order. So that's my runner up or honorable mention. Really kind of a, you know, important record from my young high school, junior high days. So. There would have been my honorable mention as well, Jay, because it's definitely a record that I never would have spun if not for Thunderdome. So. Thunderdome. Awesome. And Jorge.

02:44:37.960 --> 02:44:38.540
All right.

02:44:40.259 --> 02:44:42.000
Not no surprises here.

02:44:42.380 --> 02:44:44.100
I am going to go with Carcass.

02:44:45.020 --> 02:44:45.280
Right now.

02:44:46.000 --> 02:44:46.200
Cool.

02:44:46.960 --> 02:44:47.040
Yeah.

02:44:47.780 --> 02:44:49.800
I didn't think you were as high on it, George, but.

02:44:50.060 --> 02:44:55.920
Well, compared to everything else, I mean, it's not my album of the month because it doesn't come out this month.

02:44:56.740 --> 02:44:57.220
Right, right, right.

02:44:57.420 --> 02:45:03.300
And so maybe I'm tipping a nod to this because I'm tipping another nod the other way for.

02:45:03.420 --> 02:45:05.460
Oh, for August.

02:45:06.200 --> 02:45:06.300
So.

02:45:07.280 --> 02:45:37.240
But also, let's just see if this one worms its way into your little vegetable heart there as time goes on. Not that you don't like it already, but let's just see where it ends up. I'm sure it'll be a lister for sure. Yeah, yeah. It also might just sneak up on you, you know, and make it. There's a beast. Matt's got a beast. I can hear him around upstairs because he needs to go outside. So I know that feeling. Hey, before we sign off, George, do you want me to give Honest's information since we did not ask him for

02:45:37.280 --> 02:46:07.240
that. Certainly. Yeah. Do it. Just so when you, after the interview, if you want to find Hannes, he's on Facebook as Hannes Grossman or Mordor sounds. That's Mordor from, you know, that little Lord of the Rings thing. And you can find him on Bandcamp at Hannes. Yeah. Hannes Grossman at bandcamp.com. All right. Which I didn't think would be that hard to figure out, but in case somebody doesn't know. Hannes. Yeah, it was awesome. All right. Well, we are done here, but

02:46:07.280 --> 02:46:36.900
You've got more listening to do. So here is Hannes. So today we are joined by someone who needs no introduction. Chances are that you're pretty familiar with our guests or any of the projects or bands he's been associated with over the years. But just give you a short list. This is not complete. I'll just name a few bands. Alkaloid, Blotted Science, Counterworld Experience, Dark Fortress. I said it right this time. Eternity's End exists. The Fractured Dimension.

02:46:39.759 --> 02:47:06.760
"Moral Collapse," all right give me a second here, "Christian Munzner," I hope I said that correctly, "Necrophagist," "Obscura," "Panzer Ballet," and "Trypticon." And I should also mention he's released four solo albums. We are of course talking about Hannes Grossman. Hannes, thank you for joining us today on the Metalheads Podcast. How are you doing? Thank you for having me. I'm doing great. That's awesome. So I have two important questions to ask you right away.

02:47:07.260 --> 02:47:36.660
And this is kind of funny because we just talked about having humor. My first question is, can you tell us which albums or projects you're not associated with in 2021? And do you ever rest because you are one busy person? Well, I don't pay attention to other people's releases because, you know, it's just a waste of time. So I guess, yeah,

02:47:37.260 --> 02:48:07.240
I rest. Actually, I don't feel like I'm working that much. I mean, I know I do a lot of, especially session recordings, and the past couple of years, a lot of production work and mixing. And sometimes both, where I play drums and then I mix the album or something like that. And yeah. Work is good, right? Keeping busy is good. Work is good. And if I'm working

02:48:07.280 --> 02:48:36.440
working on. Sometimes it's exhausting, but I don't know. It doesn't feel like really hard work sometimes. It's fun. I enjoy doing it. Well, setting that joke aside, seeing as you are busy, you have a new solo album that came out this year, actually on June 1st, called To Wear the Light Retreats. For any of our listeners who may not be familiar, can you tell us about the album?

02:48:36.800 --> 02:49:06.180
How you went about just going and doing this? This is your fourth solo album. Yeah, well, the reason I do albums under my own name is just I couldn't come up with some band name. I can tell you many bands out there are just one or two people with hired guns. And you would not even, you know, you would be surprised how many of them it is.

02:49:06.820 --> 02:49:07.940
I'm talking about.

02:49:09.880 --> 02:49:10.940
Yes, Francis.

02:49:11.739 --> 02:49:16.780
And I thought, okay, I've got all these songs and I've got to release it.

02:49:16.840 --> 02:49:18.360
And then what I'm going to promote.

02:49:18.460 --> 02:49:25.200
Because with a band, from a business perspective, and this is this perspective I really don't like that much.

02:49:25.720 --> 02:49:28.300
But I mean, there's no way around it.

02:49:28.320 --> 02:49:36.760
You have to do some marketing at least to some extent and try to sell your music or get people interested.

02:49:38.421 --> 02:50:06.440
And then I thought like why promote some band name that doesn't where the band doesn't exist anyway. So it's no point I can't just put my name on on it like I don't know Devin Townsend or something like that. I mean no comparison to him but still but it's unusual for a drummer to do that but I thought well then I have to be the first.

02:50:09.980 --> 02:50:36.740
and the solo project came across because back then I was in Obscura and I wrote a lot of songs for Obscura and there was talk within the band that maybe we should do it more together as a band and I thought okay I wrote so many songs let's just get them out of the way and I'm gonna release those independently on my own and then we can start from scratch never happened but you know still

02:50:36.780 --> 02:50:40.460
But still that was the main idea and I

02:50:41.341 --> 02:50:45.220
basically the story is whenever I got like some kind of

02:50:46.520 --> 02:50:49.380
techie death metal ideas that are

02:50:51.160 --> 02:50:51.440
somehow

02:50:53.080 --> 02:50:54.120
well not similar but

02:50:55.480 --> 02:50:59.700
related to that kind of thing we did back then in Obscura

02:51:01.100 --> 02:51:03.460
or like the technical death metal side of things

02:51:03.720 --> 02:51:33.440
I'm releasing that under my name and it is really more like a fun project to just write songs and don't not not compromising them too much or you know go with the first idea or the first thing and let that be it in alkaloid where I also write music we collaborate a lot more and also don't really write lyrics there and

02:51:34.020 --> 02:52:03.400
It's more experimental. That's actually ironic, but in my solo project I'm less experimental than in one of my main bands. Usually it's the other way around, but this is just a fun outlet for me to write songs and produce them and keep that thing going. In the future there might be some different directions here and there, but I don't know yet.

02:52:03.460 --> 02:52:33.420
everything could be possible but in general it's like me releasing music that could have been released by a band under a band name and as a band project but with the people i regularly um work together and um i just release it on my own and thus i have 100 100 um control over the project right so you can kind of answer this question i was going to

02:52:33.420 --> 02:53:03.040
How do you know what something's gonna be an alkaloid album? What's gonna be a solo album? But it seems like you just wrote everything and it wasn't collaborative and that's why it went to a solo record. Is that right? Yeah. It's one aspect. The other one is it's really hard to explain. Sometimes it's more like in my head. I can write something and then maybe I finish a song even and I think like, oh, this is an alkaloid song. Right. And to me, that's most of the time pretty clear. It might not.

02:53:03.440 --> 02:53:33.400
be so obvious to other people. So as there are some similarities, but to me it's quite obvious, but it's really high. Nothing I can really explain. So do you like you write a song and then when you finish it or you've got it some kind of a stage where you know where it's going to be, then you choose which album it's going to go to or where it went? Yeah, but I know that pretty much early on. You do? Okay. Yeah, I would say so. That's interesting because

02:53:33.440 --> 02:54:02.640
I made that comment earlier this year when your album came out. I said, I got to tell you, it sounds distinctly like your solo stuff, but there's a couple songs. I was like, man, had I heard that without knowing it was under your name, I would have thought it might have been Alkaloid, just because there's some similar things that I noticed on the new album that you might have noticed on the last album released by Alkaloid. I thought this new album was a little, not a departure, but it wasn't as straightforward as the previous one.

02:54:02.720 --> 02:54:32.680
I thought you did a few things on this new one that were I don't know maybe experimental but maybe you gave yourself a little more room to expand to do things yeah yeah maybe yeah and I think I think this will happen in the future even more with stuff actually to be honest I wrote some material for the next record already and it's gonna take a little different turn maybe no that's no that's one I would say is

02:54:32.720 --> 02:55:02.680
It's not as fast as the previous albums. Previous albums had a lot of blast beat and very technical riffs and this is a little more melodic and riff, heavy riff oriented I would say. It really depends also depends in which, well, with whom I play for instance. On the last album when I recorded the previous album, Apophenia, I recorded that in 2017 and it took some time to finish

02:55:02.760 --> 02:55:32.680
it became 2019 when I released it actually but I recorded the drums in 2017 and I finished the songwriting back then and that was when I played drums for "Hate Eternal" and of course that had some impact on some of the songs being much faster than what I did before that and I would say like what I'm working on is

02:55:32.720 --> 02:56:01.440
in general and with whom I play, this has a larger influence on me as a musician and a writer than the albums I listen to. Of course, the albums, especially the albums you listen to when you were younger, kind of shape your general direction. But I really think the biggest influence is the people you play with.

02:56:02.560 --> 02:56:32.520
because you play with them every day or every week or there's a different connection there and you influence yourself on another level and that cuts way deeper than just listening to records even if it's records you listen to in your formative years when you were younger those might have a really big effect but i think um as maybe there's a drummer thing as well but as a drummer you have to interact and you have to relate and it's a very

02:56:32.540 --> 02:57:02.380
different instrument. On guitarists, most of the time you write riffs or you write parts and you play them exactly like that. As a drummer, sometimes not. Sometimes you just flow with the song, with the beat. You can improvise or do something as long as the key elements are there. And a much more, like coming from jazz music, a much more open approach to that instrument in general, I think. And that's also the way of thinking as, you know,

02:57:02.540 --> 02:57:32.160
as a writer, you take more in the input of that other people bring in, you take more of that in if you want it or not, like subconsciously or consciously. Right. But it's there. Yeah, that listening to you makes me think of another drummer that actually writes a lot of music himself. And he's in more the fusion world. That's Virgil Donati. A lot of his projects, you know, he like he wrote a lot of the music for Planet X.

02:57:32.540 --> 02:58:02.420
Yeah, I think most of it. Yeah. And so people say, oh, he's just a drummer. No, he's actually really involved. And you can hear it in the way that the songs are constructed because it's built kind of around the way he plays. Yeah. So because as I'm listening to you say this, I'm thinking I can only think of one other drummer. I know that that's that involved in the whole process. And that would be him. Yeah. So. So. Go ahead, Marcus. Well, I'm a big fan of the sound, the engineering on your new album.

02:58:02.520 --> 02:58:32.220
Can you talk a little bit about that? Like, was there anything new or important in the production that helped really shape the new record? Good question. Actually, with my own material, I'm always having trouble somehow, because you have this very distinct picture in your head how it's going to sound. And then I also have references that I really, really like different ones, different albums, and it might not even be albums that I,

02:58:32.500 --> 02:59:02.460
where I'm a big fan of the band or the music, but the sound is great, the production is great. And that's something in my head. And if I can't get it exactly right, then I'm like, I don't know. But at a certain point, I'm I can see that this distinct version I had in my head, it's maybe not in the cards this time. And then I accept what's been recorded because that's the only thing what

02:59:02.500 --> 02:59:32.460
that you can do because your recordings shape your mixing or your sound. That's the source. And good question, actually. I don't really know. It's pretty like the process is always the same kind. And I know my gear, but also the composition and the arrangement and how it's been played really shapes the sound of the album on any album. And it really brings it in a different direction because not only the

02:59:32.500 --> 03:00:00.100
Also, like how the guitarist moves his pick or something like that affects the way I tune the guitar amp or something like that. So yeah, I don't know. Well, it sounds great. That's great. That's great. I'm happy about that. It's nothing out of the ordinary. I chose, like, also like on Epiphenia, I chose not to master it myself.

03:00:01.700 --> 03:00:31.660
Because that's another step, like finalizing the thing, I'd rather give it to an engineer who's more objective, because I'm not objective at all. I wrote the music and then in the mixing process, you've lost at a certain point more or less any objectivity. And then I start comparing it. Like, what's my first impression with fresh ears in comparison to

03:00:31.680 --> 03:01:01.200
that other record that I like and so on. And then, and when I come to a point where I'm like, yeah, sounds different, but not worse, then I know I'm on the right track, you know? Right. Do you ever have fights with yourself, Hannes, the engineer, producer versus Hannes, the musician? I mean, do you ever get to the point where you're like, well, I just played this, but I want it to sound like this, and you start to kind of battle with that, and then you need to have that second set of ears in there? No, I don't think so.

03:01:01.680 --> 03:01:31.660
I'd say once I sit into that in the monitor room like what would you call control room control room yeah once I sit in there like I have to produce a hat on and that's like a completely different person um yes I know it's not easy for some musicians to do that it's you really have to to be disciplined in how you approach it yeah I don't I don't then I don't matter then I treat the drum lines like it's drum lines by somebody else huh like

03:01:31.680 --> 03:02:00.980
It might happen that I'm really proud on a drum fill or something and then when I'm mixing I'm saying it's not 100% working. Get back in there and play it again. If I can play it again well then yes. But I mean I wouldn't start mixing an album if I wasn't happy with the performance in the first place. But then I think I have to cut it out. That's too much.

03:02:01.100 --> 03:02:26.000
And then I'm thinking like a producer, not like a songwriter. You know, this phrase, kill your darlings, I'm really good at that. I do that relentlessly. I throw out riffs all the time if I think it's too much and my music is busy anyways. So you really have to balance it out and not overload it with a lot of riffs and notes that are not necessary to get the message across.

03:02:31.080 --> 03:03:00.740
to leave the song, then get out. It's not like I have to waste the idea. I have a folder on my computer called basement. That's where all these ideas that have to go, they go there. The cutting floor, basically. Sometimes I go through my basement and say, hmm. Right. Yeah, you can recycle that stuff. Right. Why not? I mean, there's no reason to get rid of it.

03:03:00.800 --> 03:03:30.760
you can still use it right exactly but you don't have to use it that's what i'm saying i think a lot of especially young songwriters they think they have to use everything they come up with but you don't it might be a big revelation to some people that uh is sometimes if you take something out the song works better as a whole and you take the idea for something else then boom another song so that's why i'm also quick with recording and writing it's really interesting because i'm a writer i write

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comic books and it's very much like that too because you have an idea of what it's going to be like in your head how the story is going to go but you might have too much in it you got to cut it back sometimes and then it's just a lot more effective yeah it is i think that's um universal for any kind of writing um i think i read that once in a stephen king wrote a book on how he writes and that's exactly what he says like he finishes it and then he cuts 20 percent i think that's

03:04:00.780 --> 03:04:30.760
which gets it down to 800 pages. Yeah, it's still 800 pages, but you know. My wife always says that he needs an editor. I'm like, he's Stephen King. He can do whatever he wants. I'm like, people's going to buy his book. He doesn't need an editor. Oh, but he admits that he uses one because he sometimes can go off the rails himself, he said. Yeah. I've experienced as a designer, you know, like say I'm going to make a logo. Like I have to do so many versions of it. I have to get stuff out of my system before I start to get

03:04:30.800 --> 03:05:00.760
to the stuff that I really like. And I feel, I would imagine that sometimes as a songwriter, you just have to get those riffs out of your system until, you know, the ones that, and it's probably not everyone you have to get out of your system, but it gets you to a point where, you know, you're, you're enjoying more of what's coming out. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Sometimes idea will stick a couple of years until I find a match. So yeah, but it doesn't matter. I mean, you don't have to read everything. Um, um, I have a

03:05:00.780 --> 03:05:30.760
a lot of spare material that I'm probably never going to use because it's not really that great. Unless I find like a switch, I don't know how to call it, like a game changer where I'm like, oh, this idea, now I see where it's going. Sometimes you just don't see it. Sometimes other people might see it. That's actually with Alkaloid, we got a song Cthulhu and I had this opening riff and

03:05:30.800 --> 03:06:00.060
I didn't know what to do with it. I thought it's a cool riff, but no idea. It just sounds like a Morbid Angel ripoff. I don't want to do just a Morbid Angel ripoff, but I couldn't come up with anything. I gave it to our singer Flo, and he came up with the rest of the song. So it worked out great. Sometimes other people have access to that. That's the benefit of the collaborations. Yeah. All it takes is a riff.

03:06:00.160 --> 03:06:30.140
And that's sometimes all it takes. It's not rocket science. It's really, even though the music is complicated, but in general, I would say it's rather easy. Right. That's funny. Good biography title. All it takes is a riff. There you go. Just a quick sidebar. That's funny because anyone who's a fan of Van Halen knows those first five, six albums, you know, when it was, when the David Lee Roth era, there's riffs used for

03:06:30.180 --> 03:06:59.560
from all throughout the early 70s on all six albums. He never threw anything away. He used everything. He eventually just got back to it at some point. So it pays to save. And then you hear about these bands that, oh, we lost a whole drive full of music. We don't know what we're going to do. It's like, man, who knows what gems could have been in there, right? Yeah. Hey, so getting back to- Yeah, but if you don't remember a single thing, like we lost the hard drive and now we're lost. We have to resolve the band.

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That happened to Kurt Hammett, didn't he? Didn't he lose his phone with like a thousand riffs or something he claimed? I think so, yeah. Probably for the good. Yes, I would agree 100%. We're on the same page with you. I heard St. Angus. I have one thing to say. My lifestyle determines my death style. Nice. Worst lyrics ever.

03:07:30.160 --> 03:08:00.100
Yeah. But I have to say, I really like, I mean, of course, you know, we're just joking around. You know, when I was 15, I love Metallica and especially Cora Cammett's solo. Still, I still think he gets way too much criticism by people. I mean, solos are well composed. Yeah. I'll be honest. I have no problems just trashing Lars's snare sound.

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It bothers me. It's bothered me since day one. And I'm okay with that. So. Yeah, but Lars is a fair target. I think you can. Anytime. It doesn't matter. Yeah, he invites it himself. Kirk, maybe he doesn't get to the credit. Yeah. Well, Lars invites it. He brings it on himself most of the time. And I still believe if Cliff Burton was still in a band that half of the shit that went on would have never happened. But maybe.

03:08:30.160 --> 03:09:00.000
You have a here nor there. Exactly. Real quick, I wanted to ask this. I think you sort of answered it. The new album, I was going to ask you this based on Aprophenia when it came out, but you sort of answered that that was already written and recorded your drum parts back in 2017. I was going to ask if the new album was a COVID album, meaning you had to do something, you were busy, or was that just a natural flow? You were just moving on to the next album. No, no. Regular album. Moving on. Okay.

03:09:01.739 --> 03:09:29.080
That's interesting because a lot of bands, they all of a sudden found the time to record. You were just moving along and keeping going. That's a good thing, I guess, because you got constant. It does make me think of Devin Towns, like you said earlier, because he's constantly working and always doing different things. Yeah, I don't know. I think it depends how you work in general. But that's the key. You work.

03:09:29.160 --> 03:09:59.140
You have to work on it. There's also this phrase where you wait around for inspiration. I mean, amateurs do that, in my opinion. Like, you're waiting around, you're waiting around. Like, if you have ideas, and I know it depends on the music, too, and the way you write. Some might be conceptually very different from what I do. If you have ideas, you have to work on them and work them out, and something

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come out of it. If it's when it's music that's mainly based on a certain feel, that might be different. Then you have to be in the right mindset for doing that. But I mean, my music is pretty much, how do you say, I wouldn't say intellectual, but it's pretty complicated. Yeah, complicated. But also I write down everything I do in notes and stuff like that. And it's, it's,

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So, yeah, I wrote one song from the last album on the plane to India because I got bored and I had an idea and I worked on it on the computer. Works for me, you know, and you have to find a method and then it doesn't really bother me if I'm in the right mood or I can just block out the rest of the world, in this case an airplane, and just write on a computer because that's what, you know,

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Novelists do as well. They sit down in a room and write. Some of them, they have to get in a certain field. I get that, but I don't. So I guess I'm lucky. Right. You're just inspired to do stuff all the time. That's true. Some people have to be in the right moment or right headspace to do things, and then other people, it just flows constantly. I'm kind of like that, too. I'm always getting ideas and writing stuff down. One of the things I want to ask about your soul album,

03:11:28.600 --> 03:11:57.400
is that your solo albums have really striking covers to me. So I was wondering how you go about selecting or commissioning art that reflects your musical vision, because it's something you're creating. So you need something on the cover that really kind of reflects what you're doing on the album. Well, I have to say for all of my music, there's a general thing. I know pretty much what I do not like. Saint Anger. Yeah, well,

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I think they're too... yeah, don't, let's not get into this topic. Maybe later. Okay. But anyway, yeah, I would say, when I have a strong feel or need to write music, that's something I like, I can see your records behind you, John. Oh yeah. Looks great.

03:12:28.620 --> 03:12:31.940
I've got many CDs, but quite a few.

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I'm probably a little older than you, so I might have collected a few more over the years.

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But then I search through my collection and I find nothing that I want to listen to right now.

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That happens all the time to me.

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Then I think I should write something myself that I want to listen to.

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And yeah, and it's more an exclusive approach.

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Like, I don't want this.

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I don't want this.

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I don't want this.

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It's like when you, yeah, I don't know. You have a special recipe and that's what you have to cook. And with the cover artwork, I don't like animation stuff too much. Depends on the animation stuff, but a lot of very animated metal covers these days, cover artworks, they are, I would say, what did Lars say? They're kind of stark.

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No, what was the, yeah. No, they all look the same to me. It's really boring. And also the themes are really, I don't know, not interesting to me. And I think like I like either painting or drawing or photography. And then most of the time it's something like that. And with this new album, Caelan did the, Caelan Stockermans did the artwork. And he paints the stuff. And maybe he enhances it some with graphical visual.

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But it looks more handmade than this typical artwork out of the can that I don't like too much. But I mean, it's a matter of taste. So I explained to him, hey, this album, Planet's Mountains, go for it. He nailed it. It's not very intellectual, but I thought like when I listen to this music, I see it.

03:14:33.039 --> 03:14:57.580
I like Jager that kind of stuff always is good yeah well it's interesting because it's very different kind of a cover than the last cover for your solo album you know that's what I like about it like you don't have like a set style you know each one kind of reflects what's going on in the music and you're using different media to showcase that I like that yeah the first two albums were done by the same artist Milan from Switzerland

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Yeah, he's great. He's also, yeah, this comic book style. I like that a lot. And those are kind of, well, similar, I would say, but they have a resemblance to it. But then for the third, I said, like, I have to do something different. Because I don't know. I know for corporate branding things, it might be better to stick with the same artists on the same kind of thing. So, but I don't know.

03:15:27.600 --> 03:15:57.020
If I was Iron Maiden, I would have killed Eddie on, I don't know, peace of mind. So maybe it's a very good thing I'm not in Iron Maiden. Well, technically he was dead on Power Slave, so they resurrected him. So, yeah. And so with Apophenia, I was stunned by the same cover artist who did the alkaloid stuff, and I love his work.

03:15:59.221 --> 03:16:27.580
This picture he had for years on his homepage. How do you say? On his website? Portfolio? You can scroll through his portfolio. Portfolio, yeah. Exactly the word I was looking for. It always, I don't know, when I looked through this picture, I was like, yeah, this looks

03:16:30.921 --> 03:16:57.580
I also like reduced stuff that doesn't have a lot of things in it and a clear, how do you say, center and clear composition. And so that's definitely the case. The lighting looks great and yeah, I put it on the cover. That was, yeah, apparently I didn't really, because somebody else is doing the promotion, of course, I was told

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There was one guy completely appalled by that cover artwork. He didn't want to review the album. Because of the cover art? Because of the cover artwork. I don't know. And I thought, great. It's awesome. If you're offended, it's perfect. I mean, what do you see? It's like a skunk alien woman, naked kind of-ish.

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And I thought that's also what I liked about it. It looks very, it doesn't look very, I don't know, it kind of looked, it could be interpreted as feminist in some weird ass way. So, you know, and that might offend some people. I like that. Yeah. You know, I loved it. I thought it was great. And it just looks so different than what you normally see. I think that's the point, Marcus. I mean, you want album covers that stand out. So you always remember them.

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and that they don't kind of get lost when you're looking at the catalog of an artist that you're like oh i can like colors i think sometimes really set that apart a lot uh like if you ever go see opeth there's mike always jokes when they play something off of still life he says this is from the red album well that's because it stands out from everything they've done even though it's travis smith and all the album covers and they sort of kind of blend like you were saying a little bit because he follows the theme but it stands out you know immediately what he's talking about

03:18:27.660 --> 03:18:56.800
So I think that's the same for your cover. The last two would immediately stand out. I'd say my favorite cover artworks are, even though it's not my favorite band or something, but the cover artworks are phenomenal. It's obviously Pink Floyd with Wish You Were Here, for instance. I think that is a brilliant cover artwork. It's not like that. The second time I was in London,

03:18:57.240 --> 03:19:24.580
We drove right by the factory and the first thing I said was, "Where's the pig?" I immediately thought of that, you know? So yes, it does stand out. You remember them. Yeah, I think that's really art and I think that's brilliant and it's photography or manipulated photography in some case, but yeah, that's really for me that's what catches my attention and so I want that as well.

03:19:29.000 --> 03:19:33.280
I don't know the section storm of the lights paint for instance

03:19:36.070 --> 03:19:42.900
I mean it's kind of a cliche that cover but I still like it a lot oh yeah oh yeah I don't have our favorites

03:19:43.010 --> 03:19:50.020
no matter what they like that you know yeah yeah fantasy and death I mean yeah yeah we dig that stuff

03:19:50.939 --> 03:20:20.300
Yeah, yeah. Anything Lord of the Rings or Star Wars, I mean. Yeah. Wait, guys, help me out. What was your friend that was on Markasson? What was it? I'll just throw on a few skull heads on the cover. Luke, when he was. Oh, yeah. Oh, Luke Orm. Yeah, Luke Orm, the cover artist, right? Yeah. I figure I'll just throw like a thousand skull heads in. This will be a cool cover or something to that effect. Skull man. He said skull man. He's like, I just, if I'm not going to be a cover artist, I'm not going to be a cover artist.

03:20:20.340 --> 03:20:50.300
I can't think of anything. I just put Skullman on a cover. Yeah. I see a Skullman. Yeah. I'm like, well, I'll check it out. There's a skull on the cover. Why wouldn't I check that out? That's great. Yeah. Hey, so we've talked about on the new album and for a lot of the stuff you've worked on, you have a similar group of musicians that you've been working with going back years. And they've all been in various forms or the band

03:20:50.320 --> 03:21:19.280
that you've worked with, but I'm curious about some of the, and I'm not, I don't mean to say some of the names that kind of stand out from other bands that you've had that are not affiliate with Obscura or Alkaloid. You've had guys like Jeff Loomis, Ron Jarzombik, you know, Pierce Nielsen, Eric Wittan, Marty Freeman. How did you go about getting some of them to guests on your albums? Because those are some, some names that carry some weight behind them for the projects and the bands that they've been involved with over the years.

03:21:20.340 --> 03:21:50.260
Yeah, and I'm sometimes still surprised they want to play on my stuff. But yeah, most of the time when I have, let's say, I guess, musician, most of the time it's guitar players because I love guitar solos. And then I write something and I have riff and I'm thinking like, yeah, that's the guitar solo.

03:21:50.340 --> 03:22:20.300
section and then sometimes i have a guitarist in mind oh that could work that would work perfectly and then like with uh lumis for the first time he played on my first solo record and i thought like that riff i came up with as a solo part kind of reminds me a little bit of nevermore um maybe not but me i i thought like well i got a little nevermore vibe in there because i like them a lot we love

03:22:20.300 --> 03:22:50.280
I love Jeff Loomis writing and his playing and I still think he should write more in Arch Enemy but let's not go there I'll take a solo album yeah I'll be happy with that from him yeah but I mean it's such a waste of talent you don't I mean they have their style of course of course don't you want those heavy ass riffs in your music why not I mean your metal band come on and he and he reproduces on stage too I mean

03:22:50.300 --> 03:22:53.060
I've seen him play so many times. He's amazing. He's great.

03:22:53.859 --> 03:22:56.860
Yeah. And he has such a distinct way of playing.

03:22:56.950 --> 03:23:01.460
I thought, oh, I can get that on that song that would nail it.

03:23:02.879 --> 03:23:05.200
And well, he played on it. He nailed it.

03:23:05.380 --> 03:23:07.700
So exactly predicted it.

03:23:08.900 --> 03:23:18.060
And, you know, with some of these players, then I also sometimes, you know, Rutan and Ron Charles and I played with them and but it's science and hate eternal.

03:23:18.300 --> 03:23:47.680
So we worked before, we worked together before and I know these guys and I love these players. And of course, if I get the chance to have them on my album, I just put it out there and ask, hey, next album, got some solo parts, you want to play a solo. And then with that in mind, I kind of construct the solo part into something that I think they could work with.

03:23:49.641 --> 03:24:17.540
So I really write for the guy who plays solos. I don't want just to put names on my album. I really think like this song, yes, this requires... It's with that song Marty Friedman plays on it. It's a very repetitive song. It's the same riff over and over again in various forms. And for that solo section, I thought like, okay, I like the song.

03:24:18.300 --> 03:24:47.260
But if I want to get that song on the next level, I have to bring in like, you know, another guitar player from another level, you know. Right. And of course, I have a variety of guitar players playing on my album who are next level. But then I, yeah, and somehow Danny and Chris, the guitar players of Alkaloid, who play on my stuff constantly,

03:24:49.239 --> 03:25:18.240
They're friends with Marty Friedman and we made contacts and he agreed to play on it. And I was like completely blown away because he's one of my all-time favorite guitar players. And yeah. And also he nailed it. Like it's, yeah. That's cool how you hear the sound and then you want to try to find the guitarist that's going to be able to bring that. Like you have somebody in mind for you.

03:25:18.300 --> 03:25:48.260
that solo specifically? Most of the time I do, yes. It's not name dropping. Sometimes I have the feeling like a lot of guest appearances are... Yeah. No, it's musically motivated is what you're saying. You want the perfect player for that song, not just because you want the name. That's cool. It starts with the music, not the person. That's awesome. Let's be honest, it's not like Ron Jarzombek is a name drop. It is if you're a big

03:25:48.880 --> 03:26:18.140
And you know what he's been involved with, but most people who listen on average metal has like, who's that? And you'd be like, I'm just going to say one word. It's technically two, but they put it to one watchtower. How do you not know that? You know, how do you not know a lot of science or any, I mean, he's an insane player. And I, and just, I, when I saw that, I was like, Oh, I have to go back. Then I didn't realize that you did that terrestrial exiled single, like way back when. So how, how did you get hooked?

03:26:18.300 --> 03:26:24.280
with him because he works but he doesn't put out a lot of stuff he hasn't for a while

03:26:24.900 --> 03:26:31.020
um through necrophages actually he came out to a show because he likes necrophages a lot actually

03:26:31.200 --> 03:26:38.260
that's how i got involved with loomis as well oh that's great at a festival and i said i really

03:26:38.380 --> 03:26:46.761
admire your work uh and he said like who are you yeah i'm here with uh obscura and uh we're playing on

03:26:46.820 --> 03:27:16.740
on the festival and they say wait a minute you're played in necrophages and awesome yeah i mean that um yeah i mean that's of course um i mean that's uh kind of well i wouldn't say famous but yeah well-known band and that's of course opens a lot of doors yeah to some people because you know well with guest appearances sometimes you don't know are these guys like on it is it

03:27:17.899 --> 03:27:44.820
"Is my contribution the only good thing that will end up on the album?" And then you consider like, "Am I really doing this?" And yeah. And I think when they hear like, "He, drummer of Necrophagist and Obscura and stuff like that," they know, "Oh, he's not a hack. You know what he's doing." And we'll take it seriously, listen to it. And yeah.

03:27:47.120 --> 03:28:16.720
I had a good laugh about that because here I'm thinking of his brother who is a fabulous drummer as well Bobby Joe Zombeck and I'm like that's really funny I almost wanted to joke so why did he take you instead of his brother but obviously I know that his Bobby's constantly busy he's always working all the time but I just found that really funny because they don't seem to play together that much even though they're both incredible musicians yeah I mean it's yeah a lot of work too and there

03:28:16.760 --> 03:28:46.640
So going also in different directions, I think Bobby, who does he play with? Well, he's been with Fate's Warning for a long time, but he's also Sebastian Bach's like long-time drummer, which is really funny because you think you see him in Fate's Warning and he does Arch Matheus also. He does all his great stuff there and then he goes and plays Sebastian Bach and I'm like, well, you know, gotta make money. Yeah, he's the best. I think most likely it's a lot of fun. Yeah, and then he also does a lot of country stuff, I think,

03:28:47.840 --> 03:29:16.180
because he lives in Texas. So he's involved in a lot of that. So I, hey, you've got to make money. And if that's going to pay your year out for you on one tour, why not? Right. Right. So what kind of leads into another question I had. So obviously you do a lot of drum session work on a regular basis. So how do you decide which projects you're going to take on or not take on, Hannes? I don't know. First impression. They sent me a demo and I listened to it and I think like, yes or no.

03:29:16.900 --> 03:29:46.060
Right. Sometimes it's also scheduled stuff. Then I'm booked for like way ahead. And then I said, I'm sorry, I can't do it. But if it's got something interesting in it, I don't know. There's nothing that speaks against it. Even a lot of the times it's also people who don't have a big name. Right. Or any name at all. It doesn't matter because as long as they're sincere to their music.

03:29:46.240 --> 03:30:16.080
They put time and effort and money in it. Why not considering it? I mean, yeah. Do they have set drums for you or do they want you to just come in and play? I assume they want you to just come up with the parts, but... Yes, I think it's a little bit of both. They have a general idea or have a program pattern. And most of the time they say, I have a program pattern here, but you know, I'm not that good at it.

03:30:16.260 --> 03:30:46.220
Right, right. So, and this is actually something that would be the second question. If I'm like, yes, the music is interesting. Second question is, how open are you for suggestions? And how open are you for taking my ideas? Because I'm done with playing music note by note, other people's music. That's what Necrophages was. It was completely the work of somebody else. And I mean, great stuff, don't get me wrong, but it's just, it's not

03:30:46.260 --> 03:31:15.120
It's not very fulfilling to play note by note. Somebody else's ideas. That might be differently, maybe with guitar because that's a different kind of instrument. Or if you play classical music or something like that, you interpret it on a piano or wherever, a violin. I don't know. For me, drumming, I always came from jazz and funk and these kind of styles, and they're way more open and not really set in stone.

03:31:16.260 --> 03:31:43.120
And only when you approach it like that and also try to improvise at some point and try to come up with something spontaneously, then really interesting things can happen on the drums that you wouldn't have come up with in the first place if you sit there and really do it note by note. Sometimes if it's really complicated and you have to really compose parts note by note and play them exactly like that because that's the only thing that really works. Right.

03:31:46.260 --> 03:32:15.220
of complex complexity. But in general, I'm beyond that point where I enjoy that too much. So I rather, you know, I listen to the, when I work on session work, I get like a track with drums or just the drums and then a track without drums and I mute the track, the drum track and I just hear the guitars, what are they doing?

03:32:15.400 --> 03:32:45.020
and I orchestrate that. What I'm feeling is the right thing because that's exactly the thing you would do in a band if you take the drama seriously. Now there's this movement by guitarists that compose their drum lines and have either drum machines play them or, you know, have higher dramas to play more or less exactly that thing and quantize it and put it on the album. If it works for these people, great, but that's not me.

03:32:45.400 --> 03:32:48.520
I'm not interested in that. That's really boring. And, um,

03:32:49.840 --> 03:32:52.260
well, one of the projects we really liked was, was moral collapse,

03:32:52.420 --> 03:32:54.800
which you did this session drum works on that. That album was great.

03:32:54.940 --> 03:32:59.100
Yeah. That was totally open. I mean, I had like riffs.

03:33:00.660 --> 03:33:04.060
Oh really? I don't think I can't remember actually.

03:33:04.820 --> 03:33:08.000
I don't think there was a fixed drum line. It was just ideas.

03:33:09.060 --> 03:33:10.940
Like, well, that had to be fun. Nice.

03:33:12.000 --> 03:33:14.440
You got to put your stamp all over the whole album then.

03:33:15.580 --> 03:33:44.500
Yeah, but I mean, that's how you interact in a band anyways. Right, exactly. In some musical way that is a little bit old school, you can meet and then work on parts and then you play something. But you have to work with the musician you're working with. If you program something on a drumming machine and then you expect that person to 100% recreate that, then you take away the chance of

03:33:44.540 --> 03:34:14.360
creating something beyond your imagination. Sometimes it has to be exactly what you came up with. Sometimes I see that and I listen to the drum arrangement and the programming and I think that really fits. I know where this is going. I mean, that really fits. Let's just play this because it's really 100% the right thing to play. So I think just the best idea,

03:34:16.119 --> 03:34:44.420
But most of the time, yes, it's like people hire me and they're not drummers. And I play drums for, what, 28 years? And probably I have a better grip on writing a drum line. Maybe. You might know a little bit about it, right? Yeah, maybe. No, Marcason mentioned Moral Collapse, which a lot of us on the podcast like that album. Another one that I completely forgotten about, even though I'm a huge fan of the band, and I,

03:34:44.520 --> 03:35:13.200
I realized in preparing for this is that you're on the album So True So Bound by Exist, which is a local band for me. They're in Baltimore. They have ties to Cynic. Max played with Cynic for a while and he did The Death to All. I remember it. I was like, damn it. I can't believe I forgot that because I absolutely love them. I think they're great. Is that another case where they sent you something or did you know them beforehand? No, I knew them. Max, we were friends before that. We toured together.

03:35:13.839 --> 03:35:43.260
We supported death to all. And so, yeah, we have a very, I would say, like-minded sense of humor. So, yeah, we got a long grade and then they approached me to, you know, they're looking for a drummer for the album. And of course, I wanted to play on that. They were a little bit more, I'd say, stricter than usual. They had

03:35:43.280 --> 03:36:11.760
a really good idea of what they wanted to hear in terms of drum lines. Because it's really written closely to the other instruments. But I accepted that in that case because it's obvious that the input matters because everything is really composed. And so the drum lines can't just be anything. And here and there I did my thing. But in general I would say that's an album that was closer to, let's say, a composed drum line.

03:36:12.280 --> 03:36:42.220
I see those guys at shows all the time at Baltimore when I go up that way. I'll walk by and I'm like, well, I know that is, but I don't bug anyone because they're with their friends. You know, some jackass walking up. Hey, you're that guy from that album. You know, but I don't do that. So real quick, one last thing about your solo stuff. All your stuff is DIY, right? You do everything yourself. Because I say that because you emailed me recently about your latest album to say that there was a delay in shipping out.

03:36:42.300 --> 03:36:42.620
the albums.

03:36:43.360 --> 03:36:43.780
Oh yeah.

03:36:43.840 --> 03:36:44.340
And that, yeah.

03:36:44.460 --> 03:37:10.880
And you sent me the, uh, the wave files and that was right around the time I was thinking maybe we should have them on. I mean, I, I now have his email and then Markisan and said, Hey, I contacted Han. It's about coming on the podcast. I was like, well, that worked out perfect then. That's awesome. Um, but yeah, do you, do you handle everything yourself, even down to that level of letting customers or people who buy your stuff, something came up, Hey, just giving you a heads up. This is not coming out or you do everything from start to finish, right? Yourself on your solo albums.

03:37:11.980 --> 03:37:40.460
Yes, I do. I have a little bit of help with packing the albums, but in general, yeah, it's completely DIY. Well, if you outsource everything, you lose a lot of money. Yeah, well, of course. There's not that much money involved in the first place. But I guess it works for you with Bandcamp because that's the way it's sort of set up. Yeah, Bandcamp is perfect.

03:37:40.560 --> 03:38:10.540
and it's not a ripoff like Spotify or something. I'm on Spotify as well because if you... And you made a whole $14 this year, right? Yeah, something like that. Yeah, it's crazy. It's unreal. Well, it's kind of a ripoff and I know that, but most of the time people that listen to Spotify, they would just not listen to you because... Yeah, it's... It's not my place to, you know, build a musician's union and fight for fair

03:38:10.580 --> 03:38:12.680
wages, but somebody has to do it.

03:38:14.239 --> 03:38:16.540
Well, we've talked about this on the podcast before.

03:38:16.880 --> 03:38:27.900
I know, at least in the U.S., Peter Frampton's actually testified before Congress about it and talked about how his song, Baby, I Love Your Way, had something like some ridiculous number.

03:38:28.960 --> 03:38:29.700
This is anecdotal.

03:38:29.800 --> 03:38:35.720
I don't know the exact number, but something like 45 million plays, and he made like $17,000 in royalties off of it.

03:38:36.140 --> 03:38:38.520
It's like one of the most played songs on the whole platform.

03:38:38.640 --> 03:38:40.380
I'm like, there's something seriously wrong.

03:38:40.560 --> 03:39:09.140
It doesn't matter if you like him or not. The song is so well known. He should be cleaning up from that thing. And that tells you there's something wrong with that system doesn't work. You don't even need to be a socialist or something to see that's fucked up because the founder of the platform is like a billionaire. Nobody's saying he shouldn't make a lot of money. He should, but not at the expense of everybody who's putting the music out.

03:39:10.440 --> 03:39:40.400
Like basically slave labor. If he can make several billion dollars, okay. How about a billion? Which is cool. Just saying. Well, you know what it set me off as his comment that, well, if you want to make money, then you need to put out more output. How many albums do you have to put out? Seriously. Come on, guy. Taylor Swift. It's like a record company that owns your material, sends you on shitty tours where you don't make a

03:39:40.440 --> 03:39:41.080
Yeah.

03:39:41.080 --> 03:39:41.180
Yeah.

03:39:41.180 --> 03:39:46.720
I'd say, where can you tour? You have to tour more. Because we're not selling as much albums as we could.

03:39:47.260 --> 03:39:49.600
I haven't been home in two years. What do you want?

03:39:53.159 --> 03:40:08.840
I mean, musicians have been exploited since the beginning of music. But still, it's just ridiculous that this internet age, it could be made differently.

03:40:09.700 --> 03:40:37.740
The producers could have the power, but then again, they don't have it. It's really frustrating. And Bandcamp, I think, is one of the exceptions because they give you 85% of the income. That's great. Even without Bandcamp Friday, that's great. Yeah, on Friday, they give it away for free. Yeah, that's great. Yeah, we usually buy a ton of stuff on Bandcamp Friday. Every time it comes up.

03:40:39.680 --> 03:41:09.660
best way to still to support artists to buy their stuff like physically or in if it's not physically then something else like a shirt or directly from the artist of course like the bands that are on labels and when you buy on band camp still the label gets the money but also i have to say if a band is on a label and you buy their stuff and the label gets it but still you're supporting the band because they get a

03:41:09.680 --> 03:41:39.660
and the label sees oh they're worth something and um you know that adds up yeah but with the street a lot of the streaming platforms it's it's it's just robbery yeah legal robbery that's what it is and you know somebody has to stop i don't know who but yeah they certainly ain't me but uh yeah that's interesting because you know the labels that you bitch about the most are the ones that are not on bandcamp and there's plenty of metal labels on bandcamp but

03:41:39.660 --> 03:42:08.760
I think every time there's a ban on Century Media I'm just like damn it now I'm gonna have to wait I'd like to hear a song but I don't want to have to fight through Century Media's web of bullshit to get to it you know whereas if it's Nuclear Blast say what you want about them at least they'll put their stuff up there you can listen to it at least you know so yeah it tells you a lot about who's on and who's not on a platform like that I think of course Century Media is part of the Sony family aren't they I think they're around yeah because

03:42:09.680 --> 03:42:39.640
or something like that. Yeah, because Inside Out is part of Century Media, which is, yeah, that's why you can't find Inside Out anywhere on there, which to me would be the perfect label for that style of music to be on that kind of a platform, too. Well, Bandcamp's definitely our favorite because, you know, it gives more money to the artists. And we've been buying a lot of stuff, especially now with COVID and everything, and bands haven't been able to tour. You know, you definitely want to throw some money their way so they can keep going and make an income. Well, it's that and the fact that you can get flack. You know, you can get the best

03:42:39.660 --> 03:42:46.180
If you're gonna go digital, you want the best possible media you can get. So it sounds the best.

03:42:46.660 --> 03:42:51.180
All of these other platforms are starting to offer better quality files.

03:42:52.230 --> 03:43:05.280
Yeah, but with streaming, of course it's like MP3s, but I have to say, or different format actually. But I have to say sound wise, Spotify is pretty good.

03:43:06.640 --> 03:43:35.360
It's good, yeah. It's just like YouTube. I'm just like, I'm not listening to this. Because who knows who loaded that up there and everything. If it's like YouTube music and it's official, then yes, that's the same quality. But Spotify, they ended this loudness war. And again, we're with Metallica on, what was their album after St. Anger? Death Magnetic. Death Magnetic, yeah. Yeah. If I'm mastering an album,

03:43:35.660 --> 03:44:02.960
and I, you know, send that to the band. They say, we will not pay you. Exactly. It's not usable. What are you doing? You're a hack. Don't stop. Mind you, I say these things. I'm from San Francisco. I was born and raised there. And every time anything past Injustice for All comes up, it's just like a piece of my heart from where I'm from starts to break a little more. It's just like, damn it.

03:44:05.380 --> 03:44:11.080
I know the Black Album is not the favorite album of most metal hats, but it's a groundbreaking production.

03:44:11.180 --> 03:44:14.620
Oh, there's no question about it. None. Yeah, I agree 100%.

03:44:14.650 --> 03:44:24.140
I mean, the albums after that, I mean, the music was a little me, but in my opinion, but also some stuff was really good. But the production was still great.

03:44:24.560 --> 03:44:24.720
Yeah.

03:44:25.130 --> 03:44:25.260
Yeah.

03:44:25.460 --> 03:44:25.840
Yeah.

03:44:26.220 --> 03:44:30.540
They actually have a podcast coming out about the making of the Black Album that I kind of want to listen to.

03:44:31.320 --> 03:44:33.620
Just to hear the stories behind all that.

03:44:36.580 --> 03:45:03.740
I'm not sure Amazon Prime, Amazon Video, something like that about the Black Album. I think it's an old one from the late 90s or something. You could just watch some kind of monster and that's all you need to know about the Black Album. Well, that's true. That was a really good documentary, actually. It is painful, but it's a good documentary. It actually is very good, but it's painful to watch. It really is. Hopefully they're in a better place. It's amusing, but there's

03:45:03.760 --> 03:45:33.740
There you go. Well, you know, it's painful for me is just watching the behind the scenes and all the just nonsense and then to see the band go along with it. And then at the end, they're like, hey, wait a second. This is all nonsense. At the end, you're like, God damn it. You know, so the first thing is they're human after all. Of course, I know. The thing is, there's a couple of scenes that I still think are so unintentionally funny. And it's the best. Like that scene when

03:45:33.780 --> 03:46:03.120
James Hetfield comes from rehabilitation. The first thing Lars Ulrich does is... It's just like, what the fuck? Yeah, I really like you. That's all you needed to know right there on that scene. That was great. Lars, if you had, is classic. If I were you, I would just delete that. Delete it. Delete it. I will give them this, though. I will give them props.

03:46:03.780 --> 03:46:09.700
the way they treated him when they signed him.

03:46:11.079 --> 03:46:16.220
Robert. They basically handed him that check just to see his expression.

03:46:17.410 --> 03:46:31.200
Whether he knew that or not beforehand. And they gave him a lot of money on the spot. I was just like, all right, you know, you may I may have issues how you treat it the other basis before him. But that was at least they didn't.

03:46:31.200 --> 03:46:59.940
I think Gene Simmons and Paul Stanley him. Yeah, kind of. Jason used that the thing probably was treated not in a really good way, but I don't think he has money troubles. No, he's done fine. So I think he's doing well. But aside from that, it's like, to me, I interpreted this scene a little bit differently because I was like, how can I put it? My first impression was like, wow, this is awesome.

03:47:02.619 --> 03:47:05.840
So apparently they like to hang out with millionaires now.

03:47:06.660 --> 03:47:07.520
Yeah, so it's bullshit.

03:47:07.740 --> 03:47:09.160
I like it.

03:47:10.280 --> 03:47:15.100
I mean, yeah, if they go to a fancy restaurant, I mean, probably they don't spend time with another anyways.

03:47:15.420 --> 03:47:22.720
But if they go out as a band on tour to a fancy restaurant and they're thinking like, hey, what if we take Rob?

03:47:22.760 --> 03:47:24.500
Do we have to take his bill or what?

03:47:24.620 --> 03:47:26.940
No, just give him a million dollars.

03:47:27.040 --> 03:47:27.720
He'll pay for dinner.

03:47:29.300 --> 03:47:59.240
They can go on Bay Area speedboat race with us and you know. Oh god. That's it. Yeah, whatever they like better than actually making music, you know. But you've changed my opinion. Fuck those guys. Yeah, I think I still like him with all the ridiculousness. And I have to say it takes a lot of balls to really put that. I mean, either completely diluted or they have like balls of steel to put that documentary.

03:47:59.400 --> 03:48:26.400
Yeah, it's true. All the obvious human weaknesses that everybody has, but they're really showing it. I have to really respect that at some point. I think it kind of takes balls. It's very entertaining to watch that movie. After all these years, it's still a very entertaining movie.

03:48:26.920 --> 03:48:50.100
I do like watching the bass player part when they all come in to play. I actually found that interesting because really you're hearing guys, but musicians try to fit in with that band for that whatever amount of time, and that's not easy to do. And there were some good bass players that showed up that played great, and they're just like, no, we're going to move on. But that's their prerogative, obviously. It's their band.

03:48:51.430 --> 03:48:54.560
But I mean, Rob Trujillo is a great bass player.

03:48:54.770 --> 03:48:55.860
Oh, that's great. Yeah.

03:48:55.980 --> 03:49:25.940
Yeah, I mean, yeah, they got themselves a really good bass player. So yeah, good decision, I would say. And yeah, I think he I think he probably fits their their general direction as a band. So yeah, yeah, yeah, I think I mean, this is the thing when you are in Metallica and you're in Metallica, then it's your job and you do nothing else. And that always comes first. That's, I think, something you have to accept if you're a little like free spirit minded or something.

03:49:26.000 --> 03:49:31.240
like that doesn't work for you maybe yeah i could imagine because it's really like

03:49:31.960 --> 03:49:40.520
corporate almost yeah it's not going to be as bad as playing for all of that um yeah yeah but again i mean um

03:49:40.880 --> 03:49:48.240
playing those shows probably is awesome oh sure yeah and they're really sometimes sometimes they

03:49:48.460 --> 03:49:54.780
up a couple of things but in general they're really good life band so yeah i i know the one person who

03:49:54.800 --> 03:50:24.480
who probably fucks up the most, but I'm not going to beat on them continuously this whole time. So anyway. Well, how does it work in Alkaloid then? Hopefully you don't have any of those problems that Metallica has in Alkaloid, but that band, you play a variety of styles. Was that something that you set out to do with Alkaloid from the very beginning with other players? How did that evolve? How did that project evolve? I contacted our singer about having a project in mind,

03:50:24.800 --> 03:50:53.080
I didn't know yet, but I wanted to make music with that guy. And then, yeah, there's obvious choices for who wants to join the band. And then on tour with Obscura, I had the idea, hey, okay, I have Flo on vocal, and Morian is his stage name, and then Linus on bass, and Danny Tonker on guitar, who can literally play anything. I think, like, three guitarists.

03:50:54.180 --> 03:51:24.120
Two awesome guitar solists right and left and then Flo also playing guitar. That's the thing. Chris, you want to join? Because he was there and I thought like, yes, yes, yes. That's it. That completes the picture. And yeah, it worked out great. Having the vision of the band and then I had

03:51:24.160 --> 03:51:53.400
some ideas that wouldn't really fit with obscura because it's already like a fixed thing. Of course you can extend it but only to a certain extent and then I think like it's better to start that from scratch and get those ideas out and then yeah I don't know a mix of having the right people and then having some ideas and then I just said like hey we shouldn't have any limits whatsoever.

03:51:55.939 --> 03:52:23.180
That had to be pretty freeing for you. Yeah, it did. It was, really. Because musically, I have to say, it's still my favorite people to play with. It's really fulfilling, and everybody is on top of the game. I can't just let it slide. Those songs are demanding,

03:52:25.159 --> 03:52:52.780
Well, everyone puts out. It's almost like a current day all-star band. I mean, there's a lot of great musicianship in the band to go along with those songs. Yeah, and I think like all these musicians, they play in a lot of bands, but still, I think, even though we play a lot of different things, still when we come together as Alkaloid, Alkaloid can become something, even though the band might not be super famous or something like that. Doesn't matter.

03:52:53.740 --> 03:53:23.680
It's out there and it stands for something and it's more than just the musicians playing. It's when these musicians play together something beyond what these musicians can do individually will come out of it and that's exactly what happened. So yeah I'm really happy and I have to say that from all the albums I did including Necrophages and everything that The Last Alkaloid Liquid Anatomy is still my favorite album I ever did. So I have to say it worked out.

03:53:25.319 --> 03:53:53.160
I love that song "Rise of the Cephalopods" from Liquid Alchemy, the 20-minute track. But also because my wife and I, we actually use cephalopod as a code word whenever we get cranky with one another to stop doing that. So my question, this is a weird question, but what is your favorite cephalopod? You mean like a Kraken? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Well, there's so many. I'll tell you mine. Mine is the vampire squid.

03:53:53.840 --> 03:54:23.720
So a vampire squid is like a six inch squid. It has webbing that connects its eight arms. It's got a bioluminescence because it lives in the deep parts of the ocean. Yes, those things are spectacular. Yeah, I think they really are. I mean, I didn't read the lyrics and I'm not the expert on cephalopods, but I have to say I'm fascinated with those really big ones that fight with the pot whales. Oh, yeah. What's up with that? That's

03:54:27.239 --> 03:54:53.100
The giant squids. It's like eight meter squids or something. I don't know. I cannot translate that to your shitty system. Sorry. It's a lot. That's all you need to say. It's a lot. It's a lot. Yeah, it's big. Big enough for you to say, I think we're going to need a bigger boat. Yeah, exactly. So are you working on some new alkaloid stuff too?

03:54:53.760 --> 03:54:57.060
some more material for solo album, but I assume there's more alkaloid coming.

03:54:57.820 --> 03:54:59.560
Actually, we're almost done writing it.

03:54:59.610 --> 03:54:59.780
Wow.

03:55:00.580 --> 03:55:05.700
Like there's a lot of songs could written and collected.

03:55:05.940 --> 03:55:13.780
And the thing is, it only exists in theory because we programmed some of the parts, but we didn't record anything.

03:55:14.330 --> 03:55:15.640
So that's the songs now.

03:55:16.860 --> 03:55:19.920
And yeah, now we record it as it's written out.

03:55:21.980 --> 03:55:22.380
That's great.

03:55:22.440 --> 03:55:51.200
I don't really know where it's going to be because it's very abstract when it starts. I have an idea in my head where it could go and everyone has but like with Flo's songs I don't really know where they're going yet. I have a demo at least with guitars but still I don't have the full picture but I'm putting one step at a time then you know first recording drums getting the drum lines right and recording all the instruments and then

03:55:52.460 --> 03:56:22.420
Sometimes we have to finalize the structure afterwards because everything is there. And then vocals is the final step where we don't know where it's going exactly. With the last one we kind of went a little bit over the top with clean vocals. So many and Flo is the only guy singing and it's almost impossible to recreate it live. So we have to figure out a way of doing that this time. Maybe have some more other guys singing. We don't know that yet, but

03:56:22.460 --> 03:56:52.420
We'll see. But yeah, I'm really excited about the material so far, but I cannot really know yet where it's going. It's what I know, it's going to be a long album and it's going to be complex and I got got to be way of wacky shit on it. That's what I know for sure. Wow. Let's see. I mean, it's not completely opposed to the last two albums. Like we're not doing these cuts

03:56:52.460 --> 03:57:22.420
I don't know there's maybe you know this band from Germany called Disillusion oh yeah they had early 2000s they had like a really epic album like opeth the emperor influenced album it's great and then the album afterwards was like almost industrial and the thing is it was a good album but they completely lost their fan base because that's not what they wanted to hear right but we're probably not doing that you know those

03:57:25.701 --> 03:57:49.500
We want to do a certain type of music, but in general, we cannot outrule strange ideas. But let's see. I think I like the material so far, so that's all I can say now. But it's almost done, and I think we can start recording soon. That's exciting. Yeah, that's great.

03:57:52.440 --> 03:58:19.340
We do a top 25 every year. We ventured one year and did 40. That exhausted me for three years. But we do a top 25 for the mid-year and end-year. And I think that my comment was, I don't know, Marcus, were you on that one in 2018 when we did that? I can't remember. My comment was for one album to rule all, which was a reference to Lord of the Rings. And Liquid Anatomy was my number one album for 2018.

03:58:22.460 --> 03:58:52.420
for the rest of the year. So I need to do that again. So I think the music we want to do in general is something for people who really like music, really like metal and to really like progressive stuff and to really like. That's John for sure. I mean, I love progressive. All of us really take progressive metal. Yeah, of interesting progressive metal stuff. There's a lot of interesting modern death metal stuff that has a lot of things in

03:58:52.460 --> 03:59:22.420
but it's really different from what we're doing because I don't know from my perspective we're still rooted in the old-school metal world a lot of the newer especially tech metal bands they're rooted in I don't know more modern bands let's say I don't know take any band I don't know progressive more modern let's say periphery they have their style but they don't really relate to

03:59:23.681 --> 03:59:52.420
more old school metal. It's not really in their music. It's really something else. And they bring other influences to the table. I didn't know these influences. Maybe I'm talking bullshit here, but I don't know. I could see that some of the people in the band take ideas from really different kind of genres, like, I don't know, Radiohead or something like that or whatever, or Trip Hop or something like that and put those ideas into

03:59:52.480 --> 04:00:22.420
their music is coming from really somewhere else. And then the Meshuggah influence and all of that. And it's really something else. But we still like Rush Metallica, Iron Maiden Slayer and Morbid Angel. And that will always be, I don't know, the common denominator. And then on top of that, it's modern classical music and all the other stuff and all the stuff we've been involved in. And it's all that. So I think that's really different from a lot of the

04:00:22.440 --> 04:00:52.420
the other more modern prog or death metal prog bands that it's it's really more rooted in traditional metal yeah that will always be the case in some way because you cannot just take that away yeah i think that's what we really like about it to be honest yeah yeah oh yeah i mean you can hear some of the influences on on the last um liquid anatomy there's a few parts where you mentioned morbid angel earlier yeah moments where i'm like whoa man

04:00:52.440 --> 04:01:22.400
That kind of reminds me a little bit of that. Although I have to admit, the opening track, George, the podfather, who's not here with us today, he sent me a message when he got the promo. And he said, hey, you got to check out the opening track to the new Alkaloid. I swear to God, I'm hearing yes on here. Yes, you are. And I heard it. I was like, whoa, this is not coming out of left field, but for someone who was on that tour, I mean, I saw them three times on the 9-1-1-1.

04:01:22.460 --> 04:01:52.420
1225 tour i was like whoa and i was always a big trevor raven fan i always liked his his approach even though it wasn't traditional yes it's not but it was always it was a cool sound that he came up with yeah i mean yeah i i think uh it wasn't supposed to be released under the name yes yeah supposed to be cinema right yeah as far as i know the record company insisted on that so but it worked i mean yeah i can say that um the reason i am you know

04:01:52.460 --> 04:02:22.420
I wrote the music for that song and the it came yeah the reason was that our singer told me that one of his first and biggest influences in rock music when he was little was that album and it's still like a reference to him and I love that album and I thought like ah this could be a resemblance but then I'm thinking like but and then

04:02:24.219 --> 04:02:49.140
I would not want to copy somebody else's style that much. There has to be something in there that the original does not provide. And also it's a very melodic song. I think that's where it is. It's the melody of the guitar parts early on that it's like, oh, I remember this is nice. Yeah, it's not them. It doesn't sound like them, but it reminds you a little bit of that, you know, which is a good thing.

04:02:52.100 --> 04:03:16.980
But then I thought, okay, what can we do about that? Because the thing that I don't really like is retro bands in whatever regard. I think that's completely... Sometimes it's fun. Sometimes it's fun, I have to admit. But it's not my approach. Let's put it this way. I would say it's the same with TV shows.

04:03:16.980 --> 04:03:46.100
And that's still why I like the new series of Twin Peaks. And everybody hates it, but I think it's brilliant. Because, I mean, I don't know if you watched that or not. A little bit. I saw a little bit of it. Let's put it this way. Yeah, I mean, it's David Lynch. It's weird as fuck. And of course, but then he kind of, well, there's no other word for it. He kind of raped the original characters.

04:03:47.060 --> 04:04:13.820
And one part of me is like, why did he do that? Like, I don't know, the main character, he's like just some kind of vegetable and like, like at least 15 episodes out of 18 episodes. So it's like, what the fuck is going on here? Then I think like, okay, who is the core audience? People who want to have a good time with the old stuff. And he's denying that completely. He says, right.

04:04:15.780 --> 04:04:45.260
Now Audrey Horne is not the cool, clever, sexy Audrey Horne. She's like some crazy on drugs housewife that you hate. You've really butchered her character. And I think this is kind of the point here. And I think like, okay, that's maybe a little far, but with that opening track on the Alkaloid, I thought like, let's lure them on a way like into like, oh, this is a prog record. Nice, nice. On nice melody. And then it's kicking the balls. Yeah.

04:04:45.360 --> 04:05:14.680
Yeah, yeah. That started coming out of nowhere. And on top of it, there are more and more and more. And then you're listening to a death metal song and you don't even realize it because you thought you're listening to an 80s prox song. And that was the idea to kind of demask this, I would say, retro ideology. Even with shows that I like, let's say Stranger Things or something, I really enjoyed that show. But of course it plays in the 80s because everything is in the 80s now.

04:05:15.640 --> 04:05:45.000
Because now the 80s is cool. The 80s were not so cool in the 80s. People want that back. They want to have a good time. Now they have kids. They want to watch Ghostbusters with their kids. And I get it. It's nice, but it's not art to approach. They got a new He-Man show that's out now. I have not watched it because I canceled my Netflix account. I'm waiting for Cobra Kai. I have to say, this is one of the things where I'm like, okay, you did.

04:05:45.380 --> 04:06:15.340
You did that justice because I think that's really fun and they're not taking themselves really seriously but they do they're not you know I think it's nice. The beauty of that. I totally disagree on that but it's a super fun. Oh no we love it. We love it. The beauty is I'm waiting for Cobra Kai to come back and then I'm reactivating my Netflix account and I'm popping out again and maybe then I have you know watch He-Man. Yeah. Yeah. But a friend of mine told me it's

04:06:15.400 --> 04:06:15.940
Absolutely terrible.

04:06:16.750 --> 04:06:19.700
Because apparently they made like some kind of, I don't know,

04:06:21.239 --> 04:06:23.680
um, identitarian bullshit thing about, um,

04:06:23.860 --> 04:06:28.300
Well, you might like it because I heard that they, they definitely subverted the original He-Man.

04:06:28.940 --> 04:06:32.400
I haven't watched it. I've just heard some things. I don't want to know too much, but

04:06:32.860 --> 04:06:34.040
they changed a lot in it.

04:06:34.320 --> 04:06:35.720
Isn't Kevin Smith a big producer?

04:06:36.130 --> 04:06:36.940
Um, yeah, Kevin Smith.

04:06:37.190 --> 04:06:37.280
Okay.

04:06:37.630 --> 04:06:37.760
Okay.

04:06:37.950 --> 04:06:40.460
Oh, the guy from, uh, what was it?

04:06:41.580 --> 04:06:42.100
So, or, uh,

04:06:43.560 --> 04:07:12.300
Yes. Yeah. And yeah, I don't know anything about it. But the thing is, you have to keep in mind the original He-Man, the core audience, you know, the 80s He-Man, the core audience was five-year-olds. Yeah, it was. If you want to do that show justice, what are you talking about? I mean, well, if you were like me and you were 15 or 16 and you're getting drinking

04:07:12.340 --> 04:07:40.100
your buddies and watching it, you know, because we did stupid shit back then. Yeah. I mean, the original human, I was, when it aired, I mean, I was born basically on German TV. Yeah. And it, it really was like, um, I don't know, Skellida coming up. I have a new weapon. It's very kid based. Yes. Kid show. And then stone of destruction. Then Merman.

04:08:06.120 --> 04:08:11.860
And half the show is just a loop. Like they would have the exact same cutscenes and just throw them into the show.

04:08:12.340 --> 04:08:38.660
In season 1 they have 65 episodes. Wow. So I mean I can see they butchered the show but I mean you can butcher a show like this. I mean I love it of course but you can butcher it by having like real characters there and then it's nothing like the origin anymore. So I don't know.

04:08:44.380 --> 04:09:12.300
I try not to watch that stuff that I loved as a kid because a lot of it just does not hold up you know like Transformers or like Thundercats or something like that none of that stuff is good anybody of you remember Saber Rider uh no was the thing no maybe it was Japanese or European I don't know was a big show on German TV hmm huh no Robotech was a big one for me Robotech but uh Saber Rider I don't know

04:09:12.540 --> 04:09:41.260
Yeah, see, for me, that would be, I'd be a little too old for some of that stuff at that point, so. It's the truth, I mean, yeah. I was just gonna say real quick about the Cobra Kai, I can't even begin to tell you how happy I was that it reminded me of the films when they first dropped, when I first saw them when they were released, I was like, it's the same exact cheesy shit, and this is exactly what I wanted. I don't want new, I don't want a new interpretation. Right. And that's kind of why I like,

04:09:42.320 --> 04:10:11.700
But it does add new depth to the character. A little bit, yes. But it's the same storyline. But it's such a believable evolution. Yes. What I love now as a kid is to how much I hated Johnny, how much I loved Johnny. He's still driving a Trans Am and everything. Yeah. And Daniel's kind of a douchebag at times. Just all the complexities of the characters. Yes. And kind of the nods back to the series. Yeah, yeah.

04:10:12.320 --> 04:10:40.940
It's really fun. And a lot of that is really just about communication because some of the times when you see like the dialogues, they have history and that they misinterpret each other. They're mad at each other. I'm like, guys, come on. Just listen to each other. You should be best friends. Come on. Well, they keep doing that. They keep bringing them together like they have an understanding and then something happens. They're like, no, fuck that. We're enemies. Yeah, yeah. I think that's really fun. It's a really fun show again.

04:10:41.860 --> 04:11:11.820
It's so good. Well, this is great, huh? This is really a great conversation. It's fun. I didn't know we were going to talk about Cobra Kai. I really like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, a lot of the time, interviews, also because of time restrictions, of course, it's about what I do, about the album. Yeah, yeah. And of course, I want people to know I have a new album and I'm doing this and this is what happened. And this is a song and I'm excited about it. But of course, it's not

04:11:11.900 --> 04:11:41.820
You know, right, right. Exactly. So I'm telling the same things over and over. And if I have the chance to just talk anything, I mean, and it's fun, then why not? Oh, yeah. No, I totally understand because I do a lot of interviews for my comic books. Yeah. So we try to ask, like, different questions as well. Of course, we're going to ask you about stuff about the album and everything like that. But we try to ask different questions whenever we have guests on. Also, sometimes when I listen to podcasts in general, I

04:11:41.960 --> 04:12:11.520
those podcasts that go out of the, how do you say, book? Off script? Off script, yeah. That go off script are actually the most entertaining. Especially stuff like thrashing Lars Ulrichs. That's what's entertaining, right? Also, it's entertaining for us because like, oh my God, what did he do? So I actually like that kind of stuff.

04:12:12.300 --> 04:12:15.320
Well, yeah, we'll talk about whatever you want to talk about, you know.

04:12:15.790 --> 04:12:15.900
Okay.

04:12:16.880 --> 04:12:20.520
You got more shows? You got more shows you want to talk about? We'd love that.

04:12:20.950 --> 04:12:21.100
Yeah.

04:12:22.040 --> 04:12:25.560
I watch a lot of shows. Actually, I watch a lot of shitty shows.

04:12:26.080 --> 04:12:26.480
Like what?

04:12:27.280 --> 04:12:28.020
So do we all.

04:12:29.119 --> 04:12:30.720
Wait, wait, wait.

04:12:31.600 --> 04:12:34.700
First of all, I watched all of Downton Abbey.

04:12:35.520 --> 04:12:36.160
So did I.

04:12:36.810 --> 04:12:39.360
I didn't even watch even the movie.

04:12:39.440 --> 04:13:08.580
Yeah, my better half said, hey, the movie, do you want to watch it? I was like, if I get to watch all the stupid shit I want, I can put up with watching this for a couple hours. Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. Bargain. That makes sense. Yeah, and then halfway through, I wonder where they put the spoon. Yeah, that's, yeah. Halfway through, you're like, I can't believe he did that. Yeah. The whole thing, what I like about it, it's so ridiculous. It's like, how can I put it? It's,

04:13:09.440 --> 04:13:39.420
I mean the whole thing just cements a class structure like from a you know from that point of perspective it's always like oh yeah all the the servants they're happy to be servants and like I'm a complete bullshit but I know that so I can enjoy that yeah it's a soap opera what else did I watch um um and I sometimes I find these shows more interesting not more interesting than the good shows but from some perspective I find that very interesting

04:13:39.440 --> 04:14:09.340
because it resembles the way some people think. You know what I'm saying? I have a hard time getting into any shows with like British royalty, the aristocracy, but my wife loves those. I kind of like it too. But yeah, it depends. They're better ones than Downton Abbey, I would say. But still. I don't know, just real quick, I don't know about you guys, but when I watched that, half the time I'm like, hey, I think that dude was in Game of Thrones. I do that all the time.

04:14:09.420 --> 04:14:13.020
I do that with every show.

04:14:13.240 --> 04:14:17.160
Everything. Every show. Everyone from Game of Thrones is in every show I watch.

04:14:17.220 --> 04:14:20.000
I'm like, oh, that dude was a dick, man. He got what he deserved.

04:14:21.620 --> 04:14:23.120
He's such a nice guy in this show.

04:14:25.500 --> 04:14:27.820
So what other crappy shows do you watch, Hannes?

04:14:28.800 --> 04:14:32.280
Actually, I watched, what was it? How to Get Away with Murder.

04:14:33.080 --> 04:14:34.700
I put my foot down on that one.

04:14:34.700 --> 04:14:38.720
That show is absolutely terrible, and I watched five seasons of it.

04:14:39.280 --> 04:15:01.460
And the most quoted sentence in that show is, I did that to protect you. And what I like about that, and it's like this stupid bullshit, they're telling themselves to justify their actions. It's really interesting how they do it. And sometimes, yeah, it's just mindless bullshit.

04:15:13.141 --> 04:15:19.100
I don't know if you watch that it's about a few episodes the flight oh yeah

04:15:19.200 --> 04:15:25.820
manifest oh it's terrible yeah but you get invested and you're like well I didn't watch this whole first

04:15:25.970 --> 04:15:31.800
season not to find out what happened to these people and damn it get to the point yeah I know yeah

04:15:32.680 --> 04:15:38.120
yeah that's true that's how every show works yeah that's how they really you in your body again

04:15:38.140 --> 04:16:06.380
What happens to your bodies? And the other thing is what I really enjoyed about it. Like, it's more complex than that. And I had some satisfaction watching it. It's, I don't know, it's done by or produced by Robert Zemeckis, the guy who did Forrest Gump. And I mean, hands down, Forrest Gump is the most terrible movie ever, in my opinion.

04:16:07.700 --> 04:16:37.320
Like this stupid bullshit. I mean, it's well done, don't get me wrong. And it's funny at times and it's entertaining. But what I am telling you, like Forrest, who had just good luck, makes a complete fortune and everything he does turns into gold. Where his friend, like Jenny, she gets raped as a kid. She then got probably raped by her boyfriend.

04:16:38.600 --> 04:17:04.340
She starts to take heroin. She has to prostitute herself and then the end she dies of AIDS. That's her story. And we get told by, well, the director or in the movie, life is like this piece of chocolate. You never know what you're going to get. And like every life is a flow and you know, you never know. I mean, that might be true to some extent, but this is the story you want to tell us that.

04:17:07.480 --> 04:17:37.420
Yeah. It's okay that Daniel Egg of Spotify gets the billion dollars. It's fine. It's fine. Spotify has all the chocolate. That's for sure. Yeah, they have all the chocolate. Yeah, clearly they're a backer. And this guy did, he produced Manifesto. Manifesto is a show about an airplane starting in, what?

04:17:37.480 --> 04:18:06.620
Bahamas or something. Somewhere in the islands, yeah. Yeah. And they land five years, five and a half years have passed. Nobody knows why, what happened. Wait, isn't this the plot of Lost? And that's an interesting setup. I mean, as stupid as it is, it's kind of interesting. I like that. It's playful. Sure. Yes. But the characters on the show, of course, like the woman is a cop because then she can solve everything. Everything's cliche.

04:18:09.459 --> 04:18:37.000
One is a doctor and she can find out all the things in his blood. It resembles to what happens on the plane. Oh my God. No one's like a douchebag or like a dirtbag. There's never a shitty drummer on the plane. You know what I mean? Yeah. Why am I not in this show? Come on. The catchphrase is not like the one with the chocolate.

04:18:37.480 --> 04:19:07.440
It's all will turn out good eventually. That's what yeah, this is the thing. The guy's mother died while he was away on the plane. And she used to say that and it's a phrase from the Bible. And so oh my god, it's so emotional. Wait, why are you watching this? Because we have to be entertained in our most dullest moments of life. If you watch the Avengers, that's the shorter version because everybody just

04:19:07.480 --> 04:19:37.440
five years and then comes back oh right right so honest i will i'm going to say something so uh we've been watching a lot of non-us shows on netflix because they've really upped their foreign for us it would be foreign market shows so we get a lot of shows from england wales i mean canada's not it's just it's a neighboring country but we get a lot of shows now new zealand australia and i have to say everything that's bad about hollywood which is like the

04:19:37.440 --> 04:20:07.420
has seeped all around the world so no one can complain about us anymore because the same bullshit that are on our shows are showing up in those shows and i'm like damn it i thought you were better than us it's like movies made for german tv um they don't have a big budget of course and they use theater actors who were in um i don't know plays before that were either about soviet union or nazis and that's

04:20:07.460 --> 04:20:37.420
That's how they play and the story is then a rip off from a famous Hollywood movie like there's a movie they produced for TV it's called like something like Berlin freezes or something like that and it's basically the day after tomorrow. Oh yeah Dennis Quaid yeah but then they do it with German actors and and you know no production value and it's terrible and they have public money spent

04:20:37.460 --> 04:21:07.420
you know the spending on these films and I'm like oh my god so I don't know and of course they're influenced by Hollywood but most of the time not by the really good stuff there are good movies and there's good stuff in Germany but really I have to say this also goes for our market that the cheesy the corny Hollywood stuff that gets adopted really quickly and what I think if you really think what shows

04:21:07.480 --> 04:21:37.420
are really successful, like Breaking Bad and Game of Thrones, big budget, out of the box, that kind of stuff. Twin Peaks back then to begin with, people want that. I think a really big audience wants to get surprised, but that's not the way how producers think, because producers are businessmen. I think like this sold in the past, going to sell in the future. Most of the time it does. Like Star Wars, when it came back, it was just a rehash of all the movies before, and I hated that because I

04:21:37.440 --> 04:22:07.420
like the stuff that's newer. You know, I want to see new adventures. I want to see them. It's such a huge world. I want to see them try to just take chances, take more chances with it and give us something new. But it doesn't always happen. I get it. I get why they do it. But it is very frustrating to me sometimes. From what I read online and stuff, the Star Wars fans kind of hate the last one. I mean, yeah, I actually like the last one better than the first two. I agree with that, too. You know, it's funny. I actually like

04:22:07.460 --> 04:22:37.420
the side stories better for all the new stuff i actually liked han solo story which me too seem to hate i love it too and i love it that much i like that war movie what was the name um rogue one yeah i love that it was very good because they were different they didn't rely on rehashing the same story over i think that's why i like them more so my favorite actually is the clone wars cartoon that's by far my favorite yeah yeah see empire is always going to be my favorite

04:22:37.440 --> 04:23:07.200
because when I was a kid, real quick, I spent all my summers in Lake Tahoe and some of my winters. And my next-door neighbor went to school at a place called UC Davis, University of California, Davis. And he met with George Lucas. I don't know how he met, but he told me in the summer before Empire came out that there's going to be this great revelation that people are going to be shocked and that Darth Vader might be Luke's father. I was like, this is absolutely insane. It will never happen. Then I saw the movie.

04:23:07.440 --> 04:23:37.200
And now, this is what, 1980, so I'm 12. My mouth could not hit the floor any faster and bounce back up. I was like, he really is his father. Oh my God, Scotty's brother was right when he told me the story two years ago. It blew my mind. Back then, when did the movie come out? 79 or something? 80 for Empire. Yeah, 80. Okay, 80, 1980. That was a big revelation. Now there's not a single show with these kind of twists. Nothing, yeah.

04:23:37.460 --> 04:24:07.420
Back then you're like what the fuck? You're waiting for, oh, this is like they're somehow related to some. Or he moved back in time and now they're related. He's his grandfather or something like that. That's storytelling now. They're totally milking that thing, but back then it was completely unthinkable. Like, what? I can't even tell you guys how huge that was when that drop. People were like shocked. It was kind of like the whole, who shot JR? I know that's very old for most people. People were

04:24:07.600 --> 04:24:37.180
just blown away when they heard that ending. I was like, eh, I don't really like this show, so I don't really care. I mean, it happens every once in a while. Sorry, go ahead, Matt. No, I was going to say, I totally agree, John. And I can literally say I shit myself, but I was wearing diapers at the time when I was talking about his dad. And, you know, like we were talking, like, I think I was just really excited that Star Wars was going to continue, you know, with these new movies and stuff when they were announced. But yeah, I'm with you guys on some of the side stories. But it's been fun to see my kids adapt to it.

04:24:37.460 --> 04:25:07.420
you know they're they're not going to like those old movies like their mom and i do but but seeing them get excited about some of the newer stuff but but yeah we are like rogue one is probably our favorite thing out of the newer stuff um but i'm with you on that third movie and it'll be interesting to see has anybody watched the bad batch yet i haven't watched it yeah i know too much television yeah i know so hannes we we know that forrest gump is your least

04:25:07.440 --> 04:25:37.420
favorite movie of all time the worst movie not my least favorite movie but i think it's a it's actually a bad movie right well but well movie professionally done but the whole story and message is completely what is your favorite movie though but i will just say your commentary on it is the most interesting i've heard on forest commentary like your perspective on it was the most interesting thing i've heard about that movie so what is your favorite um i don't have one favorite movie i can just

04:25:40.480 --> 04:26:07.400
I got this question of my friend of mine and I don't know what what it is. Yeah, I know this is a typical question because we always want to have that one thing that favorite thing. But sometimes I don't know. I have to say also with being the age I am that the Lord of the Rings movies are still my favorite movies. Because I yeah, I read the books I was a big fan my

04:26:08.480 --> 04:26:09.000
Yeah.

04:26:09.890 --> 04:26:10.020
Yeah.

04:26:10.020 --> 04:26:37.200
You know, it comes from something. And of course, I love these movies. And I think like, when I watched those movies, every character was exactly like, imagine it. Like, Gandalf. Yes, that's gone. Yes. 100, 100. 100%. And, yeah, and they did that justice. And I still can, I still watch these movies, even though I've seen them like, I don't know, six, seven, eight times.

04:26:37.400 --> 04:27:07.380
I think it's the best trilogy ever I just watched the extended versions like all day yeah so good you have to watch you have to watch everything yes because hey just real quick the greatest movie experience of my whole life I mean I've had a few but I went with a buddy of mine to see the first film of the three and I knew that it obviously was going to be three films he didn't know that and at the end of the film you know it just ends with them like continuing the journey and the lights come up and he's

04:27:07.400 --> 04:27:37.260
He's like six foot five, six foot four, former wrestler, huge guy, just stands up and goes, this is fucking bullshit. The theater just screams it out. And I literally, tears are coming out of my face. Dude, it's a continuation. He just got flipped out and just left the theater screaming. And I just like, literally, this last three hours was worth it just for that two seconds. That is the greatest moment I've ever had in my life. And you mentioned Lord of the Rings. I was like, I could never watch this ever again without thinking of.

04:27:37.420 --> 04:28:07.380
just losing his shit at the end of the first move a friend of mine told me he was in a revenge of the sith star wars and he didn't know the movies are related to star wars really and he's not a fan and at the end was like why does he turn into that figure from star wars makes no sense that's crazy right wow those are what make you in a star wars movie and you don't even realize it it just does make the moment

04:28:08.021 --> 04:28:12.480
It really does because you can attach something in addition to what you just did.

04:28:13.190 --> 04:28:13.320
Yeah.

04:28:13.680 --> 04:28:15.020
But favorite movies.

04:28:15.360 --> 04:28:15.820
Let's see.

04:28:16.790 --> 04:28:18.280
The Godfather still.

04:28:18.660 --> 04:28:19.100
Yeah.

04:28:19.150 --> 04:28:19.280
Yeah.

04:28:20.841 --> 04:28:22.180
Like the first two.

04:28:22.500 --> 04:28:24.120
Actually, I kind of like the third part.

04:28:24.500 --> 04:28:26.880
Nobody likes it, but I still like it.

04:28:28.780 --> 04:28:32.500
It's not as good as the other two, but still worth watching.

04:28:32.810 --> 04:28:33.000
Yeah.

04:28:34.220 --> 04:28:34.800
Then what else?

04:28:38.360 --> 04:29:02.480
I'm going to list the classics first. And then my favorite bullshit movies as well. At least I get some street credibility. Or you could have just redeemed yourself with the cool ones at the end. We thought you were progressive and avant-garde. We want to hear that. I go for the other way. I like Downton Abbey.

04:29:07.280 --> 04:29:11.520
I would say what else taxi driver I think it's still one of the best movies

04:29:13.580 --> 04:29:22.360
I'm a Hitchcock fan I am my favorite films are a rope vertigo the birds and what was the rear window of

04:29:22.540 --> 04:29:29.460
course rear window choices yeah and one movie I think is very underrated Marnie I think it's a fantastic movie yes

04:29:30.060 --> 04:29:34.940
I work with somebody named Marnie she was named after the film oh wow wow

04:29:36.260 --> 04:30:04.880
So yeah, these movies can watch all the time. I think they never get old and you still see new things and very inspiring movies. What else? I probably have to say the original Star Wars because yeah, just because. What else? Yeah, let's see. I'm missing something.

04:30:06.160 --> 04:30:34.920
I'm like damn it I think John and I have the our favorite movie is the same yeah which is weird but it's Blade Runner absolutely it's a great movie of course yeah even with all the controversy over the intro and the the voiceovers and the same friend who lost it during Lord of the Rings just is still fighting about whether or not Deckard's a replicant or not that even makes it more enjoyable for me is knowing that it bothers him still

04:30:34.940 --> 04:30:35.220
this day.

04:30:37.790 --> 04:30:37.900
Yeah.

04:30:38.570 --> 04:30:38.680
Yeah.

04:30:38.680 --> 04:30:45.040
Then I would say maybe favorite movie does not cut it because you have to be in the mood

04:30:45.160 --> 04:30:49.480
for it, but I would still say Mulholland Drive by David Lynch is a very nice.

04:30:49.760 --> 04:30:50.180
Nice.

04:30:51.200 --> 04:30:51.820
That's a good film.

04:30:54.119 --> 04:30:54.560
Yeah.

04:30:54.630 --> 04:30:58.940
I mean, it's so weird and there's so strong scenes in it, but you don't know what to

04:30:59.040 --> 04:30:59.580
make out of it.

04:30:59.920 --> 04:31:02.700
It's really, really a mind fuck, I think.

04:31:03.180 --> 04:31:32.700
Most of this stuff is a mind fuck. Yeah. Yeah, it is. What is the one he did with Dennis Hopper? Is it Blue Suede? Blue Velvet. Blue Velvet. Yeah. That scene. That's a great movie. When he takes the oxygen, I was just like, this is so fucked up. And I just couldn't get enough of it. Yeah. I really like David Lynch's stuff. It's different than anybody else. You like Dune? Oh, of course. The Shining. Oh, nice.

04:31:32.940 --> 04:32:01.480
The Shining, of course, one of my favorite movies. I know Stephen King hates it, but he's a good writer, but movies are not a thing, I guess. No, most of his books don't translate well because they're never interpreted well. I know George might have some disagreements about it because he's a big fan of Stephen King. But I actually like The Shining. The Shining's good. Green Mile's good. Speaking of, did anybody watch Lisey's story?

04:32:04.060 --> 04:32:32.520
Yeah, we stopped halfway through. I just was done. No. It's bizarre. Yeah. Shawshank, I thought, was good. I enjoyed that. That's Stephen King. Yeah, it's entertaining. Dark Tower, not so much. Yeah, so what's funny, John, is you say that we're talking about these trilogies. We're talking about Lord of the Rings, the extended cut. And then the first thing that popped into my mind was, basically,

04:32:32.940 --> 04:33:02.860
and your friend said, oh my god, this is already done. The first thing I thought of is like, Dark Tower, seven books, 90-minute movie. Like, what is that about? That movie was, I don't know. I don't know what it was. Yeah, I mean, I had read all seven books. It took me three times. I read the first three books three different times, you know, to finally get my momentum to get through all seven. And then knowing that, oh, it's going to be a movie and then a miniseries and all these other, you know,

04:33:03.120 --> 04:33:32.820
pre-production conversations they had that I was reading about, and then it's like, you get 90 minutes? Like, what? You know what that movie was, Matt? That was the end-of-year budget. You gotta spend it or lose it. Well, we're gonna lose the budget at the end of the fiscal year, so let's just make this shitty-ass movie. Yeah, what they should have done is they should have just done The Gunslinger as a movie and then launched right into a television show. Yes, and then end it with a movie. If you have leftover money, isn't Adam Sandler doing something?

04:33:34.920 --> 04:34:02.900
You know what? In this case, I'd rather watch an Adam Sandler film than The Dark Tower. I have to say, this comes back to telling you about these horrible shows I watched. I kind of enjoyed Jack and Jill. Oh, yeah. I didn't mind that one. So straight up terrible, you cannot believe it. Yes. He plays his own sister and it's annoying from minute one to the end. And I kind of get...

04:34:02.939 --> 04:34:32.740
It's not funny. The jokes are not funny, but it's funny imagining a person watching this and get mad over it. Like in the cinema, I paid 15 bucks for this shit. Yeah. This is fun. The guy has a sense of humor. Yeah. Got it, man. You should watch that one with your giant wrestler friend, John. Oh, he's a huge movie fan too. And a lot of times I agree with him on stuff, but he just lost it during that. Yeah. So.

04:34:32.939 --> 04:34:40.381
I have to say one thing also, one movie I really like is Gran Torino.

04:34:41.119 --> 04:34:41.561
Oh, yes.

04:34:41.859 --> 04:34:46.840
That's the movie from the newer movies, because I'm mostly named like older movies.

04:34:48.740 --> 04:34:54.400
Then I have to say some movies I really like, and I know they're not, maybe not classics.

04:34:55.480 --> 04:34:57.080
Also for maybe the wrong reasons.

04:34:57.801 --> 04:35:00.100
There's one, you know, you know the movie Everest?

04:35:01.160 --> 04:35:02.881
It's about climbing Mount Everest.

04:35:03.061 --> 04:35:03.641
Oh, right, right.

04:35:03.721 --> 04:35:04.920
They die and stuff.

04:35:05.260 --> 04:35:07.061
And it's pretty predictable.

04:35:07.320 --> 04:35:10.580
But the reason I like it is simply I like mountains.

04:35:10.840 --> 04:35:12.080
And I've been there.

04:35:12.340 --> 04:35:15.900
And, like, not on course I didn't climb it because I want to live.

04:35:16.500 --> 04:35:21.439
But, you know, I was in the area and it's absolutely beautiful.

04:35:21.779 --> 04:35:28.500
And the way they covered, the way they pictured it, it really looks like it's supposed to look.

04:35:28.619 --> 04:35:58.520
It's not some, I don't know if you know vertical limit and that kind of stuff. It's supposed to be K2 and it looks, I don't know. If I'm going to watch a mountain movie, I'm watching Stallone and Cliffhanger. Oh, so good. I've been to the Himalaya and I'm totally fascinated with that stuff. And the only thing I have to say about Everest is my only thing is like the first 20 minutes, they could have just gone hiking.

04:35:58.619 --> 04:35:59.301
a little bit.

04:36:01.781 --> 04:36:04.980
In the base camp already after like 15 minutes.

04:36:05.211 --> 04:36:05.660
What the fuck?

04:36:05.891 --> 04:36:08.461
I mean, it takes like five days to get there.

04:36:08.680 --> 04:36:09.561
Just take your time.

04:36:10.400 --> 04:36:11.160
Enjoy it.

04:36:11.160 --> 04:36:11.539
A few things.

04:36:12.000 --> 04:36:12.699
I like it.

04:36:13.061 --> 04:36:13.721
Let's get some pictures.

04:36:14.600 --> 04:36:17.779
It's the only thing I have to say about that movie that I didn't like so much.

04:36:17.939 --> 04:36:18.580
More hiking.

04:36:19.740 --> 04:36:23.061
But other than that, it's also a pretty intense movie.

04:36:25.660 --> 04:36:26.061
What else?

04:36:26.779 --> 04:36:28.699
I kind of have a thing for the

04:36:28.980 --> 04:36:30.820
conjuring especially the second part

04:36:30.910 --> 04:36:32.760
and I just watched all three

04:36:33.410 --> 04:36:34.881
the only reason I like

04:36:34.891 --> 04:36:36.779
those films because they're more

04:36:37.080 --> 04:36:38.500
classical horror movies I know

04:36:38.721 --> 04:36:40.561
also it has a bit the retro aspect

04:36:40.721 --> 04:36:41.859
but I don't care

04:36:42.840 --> 04:36:44.740
but I think they work really

04:36:44.881 --> 04:36:46.539
well and I have to say the second movie

04:36:47.020 --> 04:36:48.461
I know it's only because

04:36:49.600 --> 04:36:50.939
when you make a horror movie

04:36:50.990 --> 04:36:52.180
and you have a great monster

04:36:53.561 --> 04:36:54.680
yeah that's half

04:36:55.439 --> 04:36:56.199
half the price right

04:36:56.920 --> 04:37:26.180
And that none is creepy. And I like it. It's this typical antagonist. Yeah, it's so well pictured for me. I know it's kind of a cliche, but yeah, nothing to argue with here. I like that movie. What's funny about all of those films is that Annabelle the doll is actually the creepiest thing in that whole series, but people don't think of that. Even though, and the funny thing is that the doll they use in the movies doesn't look

04:37:26.221 --> 04:37:31.840
anything like the real Annabelle doll which I find even funnier so I like the

04:37:32.061 --> 04:37:37.000
psychological ones I really like that movie midsummer that's one of my favorite ones oh you

04:37:37.180 --> 04:37:42.721
should watch that's good that's good I think you'll dig it it's really good they haven't they

04:37:42.859 --> 04:37:47.859
actually it's really intense they actually have um they did an extended version of it that you could

04:37:48.080 --> 04:37:52.959
buy on blu-ray and I bought it because I liked that movie so much and I don't usually buy movies

04:37:53.480 --> 04:38:22.740
But there's something about that film that just is so creepy, so foreboding, and you're watching it. It's never, you know, jump out scared or anything like that. It just works on your head. Yeah. Sixth Sense is a little bit like those classical horror movies, and I kind of like it. I know it's not a spectacular film, and the twist. I have to say, though, I was in the movies back then I saw it, and sometimes you hear people about,

04:38:22.961 --> 04:38:52.881
saying about the movie, it's kind of obvious, isn't it? Maybe from today's perspective, but I was in that cinema and it's exactly what, what I cannot pronounce his name. Um, what the director said. Yes. What happened when he test screened it, they all, everybody thought the film is over and then, oh, he's dead and silence, complete silence. Everybody was caught off guard and it's like, what the fuck just happened? Yeah, no, I think a lot of people were surprised.

04:38:52.961 --> 04:39:17.500
It worked really hard. It happened. But aside from that, it's a good ghost story. I kind of enjoy that. I enjoy that more than, let's say, hostile or some brutal horror movie like that. Saw. Saw, yeah. It's entertaining, but it's just about brutality.

04:39:22.980 --> 04:39:52.940
The thing is, I'm not afraid of horror movies. And I'm still looking for a movie that really, really scares me to the core. I don't know. Doesn't really happen. I kind of enjoy it. Because I know it's not real. And especially the supernatural stuff. I mean, maybe I'm too much of an atheist for, you know, I don't know. But I don't believe in anything supernatural. And that's kind of the burden as a

04:39:53.000 --> 04:40:22.820
movie lover. Yeah. Because if you were more open to that stuff, then oh my god, it could happen in my house. But I know now it's not going to happen. And that's why I can really enjoy that. But with Hostel, I don't know. That stuff might actually go down in some weird-ass Ukrainian downtown. Dungeon? Hostel? Hostel? I don't know. I will say. Paying to torture people.

04:40:22.960 --> 04:40:52.920
I think that's really creepy. That's dark web stuff, man. Suchi-Americans. Yep. It's not in the list of my favorite movies, but just thinking about that. So, yeah. That's actually, I find that movie creepier than any of the ghost shit, but I really enjoy the ghost stuff more. So, Hannes, have you seen any of the Paranormal Activity movies? Yeah. Okay. So, like you, I love horror, and it's a constant conversation.

04:40:52.960 --> 04:41:22.100
in my home because my wife hates horror. And I'm always like, yes, bring it on. I'm not scared. I love it. But Paranormal Activity, the first one, and a little bit of the second one, that was two movies I've actually jumped at. Like I was startled by. You want to know why? It's because if you have your own security system at home, you could imagine that happening, that you're watching your video. The next morning you wake up, you're like, what the fuck just happened in my house last night? That's exactly why that film works.

04:41:23.820 --> 04:41:52.020
Which is also why I have none of that stuff in my home because I'm like, man, I don't want to know what's going on when I can't see it. You know, not necessarily ghosts, but who knows what else is going on in the neighborhood. But I want to know because I want to know if those fucking raccoons are jumping on my garbage can and I got to go out there and clean up after that night. So I do want to know. Yeah, was it high school kids or was it raccoons? Yeah. Oh, it's raccoons. Trust me. I know. I caught them on video. I really like Blair Witch Project. That creeped me the hell out because it just felt real.

04:41:52.180 --> 04:42:22.140
Yes. And paranormal activity has a little bit the same kind of how it's done. You know, actually real like home cameras. Found footage. Yeah, the found footage. That has a little bit. Yeah, it's closer though. It doesn't look as nice, but you think you're in this thing. So yeah. Actually, I have to say, yeah, sometimes movies that are not meant as horror movies can be a little more unsettling. I thought like The Village had some really

04:42:22.160 --> 04:42:52.140
I love the village actually people hated it because they were trying to figure out the ending and said that they figured it out but I thought it was just really really well done movie I think when you watch his films you just after the sixth sense after you got tricked the first time you should probably just not try to figure it out going forward you end up not enjoying the film to be honest with you because while the films may not be great sometimes the stories are kind of interesting you know and I think I think that's why I like

04:42:52.160 --> 04:43:22.140
signs maybe the most of his stuff because i wasn't trying to figure out what's going it was pretty obvious what was going to happen at some point you just didn't know how it was going to end but you weren't like the village you didn't know well is this really set back in that time period oh no it's just a bunch of people who got pissed when they were in their 30s and they moved out and just started their own thing you know oh absolutely absolutely that's a bunch of rich people got out of it really really great about it because um yeah there it was like weird settlement that can only survive

04:43:22.180 --> 04:43:52.140
because it's guarded by the real world. And they're playing their own world being like, I don't want to have anything to do with the outside world and it's bad and stuff like that. But that only works because there's the outside world. Yeah. And then they created their own evil world. So that like, you can only live in the forest with no supplies because there are supplies. Right. You wouldn't want to do that when everybody was living like that, you know? Yeah. It's especially

04:43:52.180 --> 04:44:21.480
Yeah, that's exactly the thing that the movie is stating at the end. And going back to Forrest Gump, I think The Village, that's a clever message. I don't want to overanalyze it or anything, but you watch the movie, but it makes sense on a level that is not just entertainment. With Forrest Gump, it's the complete opposite, I think. Run, Forrest, run! This heartwarming story, they lure you in and you're, yes, yes, yes.

04:44:21.600 --> 04:44:50.820
Yeah, I really like most of M. Night Shyamalan's movies a lot. I don't. I like the first couple of movies, and then I thought Glass was interesting. Yeah, I like that trilogy I really like, actually. I think it works really well, especially if you watch all of them together. Yeah. I want to see that movie Old that just came out, because his latest movies have been pretty good. Okay. Yeah, I didn't even know he has a new one. Yeah, it's called Old, where these people go to this island, and they're like,

04:44:50.940 --> 04:45:20.920
aging fast. He also, I believe he produces that show The Servant. Has anybody watched that? No? Sounds familiar. It's good. I like it. It sounds like another British aristocracy. It's on, no, it takes place, I think, in Philadelphia. Well, yeah, because all his stuff is in Philadelphia or Pittsburgh. It's on Apple TV. It's worth a watch. Okay. It's only half hour up

04:45:20.960 --> 04:45:49.200
That is one thing I struggle with too with some shows. Like when each season is 24 episodes, that's a commitment. I like it. There's only one show, and I know Markisan likes this show too. There's only one show that I needed like 50 episodes of season four. Only one. That's supernatural. I had to have Sam and Dean every week.

04:45:50.940 --> 04:46:19.740
those two characters. I know it's with a guy from Gilmore Girls. Yes. That's funny about it. Yeah. Well, you have 15 seasons to go back and watch. It's just honest. Okay. One day. It's great. The beginning's not great. I forgot. I forgot a stupid show that I watched. Okay. You might know this designated survivor. Oh, yes. Yeah. I've seen it. Kiefer Sutherland. Kiefer. I was hoping for another 24.

04:46:21.160 --> 04:46:50.700
So the first half of the first season, you're like, okay, I can run with this. And you're like, wait a minute. This is changing really fast. Yeah. So, Honus, have you watched the show 24? No, I have not. I have not. It's kind of, like, for me, it's stupid good. Like, it's very cheesy. Like, Kiefer Sutherland, like, this is his job. He takes it so seriously, like, more serious than I take anything in my entire life. You know, like, patch that through to my

04:46:50.760 --> 04:46:51.940
Blackberry, we're out of time.

04:46:54.160 --> 04:46:59.100
I've seen all 10 seasons and I was hoping Designated Survivor was going to be a continuation of that.

04:46:59.340 --> 04:47:00.900
And it just started out.

04:47:01.560 --> 04:47:03.520
It flamed like halfway through the first season.

04:47:04.218 --> 04:47:04.620
Exactly.

04:47:05.000 --> 04:47:05.160
Exactly.

04:47:05.500 --> 04:47:07.880
That's an interesting, I don't know.

04:47:09.080 --> 04:47:09.660
It's kind of interesting.

04:47:09.720 --> 04:47:15.920
But again, here we're like in this, well, it's the story to get, you know, the listeners

04:47:15.920 --> 04:47:45.800
And the story, for anybody who has not seen it, and don't watch it, the story is Designated Survivor apparently exists. It's like this one politician who has stayed insecure. And all the politicians meet in Washington, and then the Capitol gets blown up. And then Kiefer Sutherland is the only guy who survives, like from the head of politicians. He's minister of something. And here's the interesting part.

04:47:45.940 --> 04:48:14.340
He's not part of Democrats or Republicans. He's bipartisan or nonpartisan. And slowly he's bringing everybody in and it's a big family. And this is complete bullshit, I'm sorry. This is the end of politics. It's like the opposite of politics. But that's what people want. Some people are like, oh, can't we just go together and sing Kumbaya? But I mean, come on, it's not happening. It's a struggle.

04:48:15.740 --> 04:48:40.960
As someone who lives in D.C., I was going to say, as somebody who lives in Washington, D.C., the area, that idea, they do do that. They do hold one actual member of the cabinet back every time when they meet for that very reason. I think even Tom Clancy's broached that in one of his books, I think, at one point. I think that's how Jack Ryan at some point becomes president, if I'm not mistaken. I could be wrong. So some of our listeners know.

04:48:41.000 --> 04:49:07.480
So it's not even a fresh idea. Yeah, probably not. It's an interesting idea, but it bottoms out fast. It is. Yeah, yeah. It doesn't really hold longer than like three or four episodes. And then at some point it's really getting annoying because also Kiva Sutherland, I mean, I kind of like the guy, but it's, he talks like in this ASMR videos, like, you have to bring everybody in.

04:49:11.540 --> 04:49:40.800
to follow what Matt said. You need to watch 24 first. Then you get it. Yeah. So the premise of it is like every season is 24 episodes. So each episode is basically an hour of his life. And so the whole season is basically a day of or a week of his life. No, one day. One day. Is that true? He's beating up a lot of people. Oh, yeah. He's just he's kicking ass and shooting. He's part of the counter.

04:49:40.980 --> 04:50:09.560
You know, it's hard to see him like that after watching a movie like Dark City, where I thought he was awesome. You know, as this kind of creepy doctor and that. Even the original Flatliners. Yes. I only watched the remake, not so good.

04:50:15.260 --> 04:50:19.340
Actually, I read somewhere that there's a Titanic 2 movie.

04:50:19.740 --> 04:50:21.500
What? Oh, God.

04:50:21.680 --> 04:50:21.800
Yeah.

04:50:22.638 --> 04:50:24.880
Let me give you a hint. They probably don't live.

04:50:25.780 --> 04:50:25.940
Yeah.

04:50:27.600 --> 04:50:29.680
From the icebergs perspective.

04:50:30.380 --> 04:50:30.720
Hold on.

04:50:31.980 --> 04:50:32.440
Hold on.

04:50:33.680 --> 04:50:35.600
There has been a Titanic 2.

04:50:35.640 --> 04:50:36.640
It's been, what's his name?

04:50:36.660 --> 04:51:06.620
the director going back constantly to rehash his footage as he dives a little deeper the next time so we'll see the titanic in avatar 2 i i hope there's a cephalopod in it that's all i can say i like that man i refuse to watch avatar because i thought it was just like this is bullshit um i know yeah but still there's never been made a really great um uh lovecraft movie no it's true

04:51:06.640 --> 04:51:36.520
Yeah, they've had elements in television shows and movies, but you've never really seen a straight Lovecraft interpretation done well, ever. No, I wonder who could do it. I have no idea. Actually, David Lynch would be a good candidate, but he's really old. Yeah. Might not be his thing with monsters, like obvious monsters. So I don't know.

04:51:36.660 --> 04:52:04.600
Maybe I'm wrong here, but I mean, I just think maybe a guy like that, like out of the box, like completely weird. Maybe a guy like that who could do it. I actually think Guillermo del Toro would do a good job of that. Yeah. Oh, yeah. He's good. Yeah, he's a little weird. Yeah. Just a tad. Maybe it needs to be like a collaboration, like David Lynch, Guillermo, and Stephen King. Yeah. No, no, no, Stephen King. All right, M. Night Shyamalan.

04:52:09.900 --> 04:52:10.420
Yes.

04:52:10.920 --> 04:52:36.100
Whenever he's hosting, a lot of the time he's sitting in the back and tells him what's going on. I don't know. His ideas of movies is kind of stuck in the 50s, I think. The movies he grew up with, he likes that. And I get why he doesn't like Shining. It's not the book, but that's the point.

04:52:36.180 --> 04:53:06.140
You know, films are not books. So. Well, Stand By Me is one of my favorite movies of all time. Agreed. Same. But wasn't the remake of The Shining was like a six-hour TV miniseries? Yeah. To me, it almost felt really watered down, you know? When you have, like when Stanley Kubrick makes it, just leave it alone, you know, at that point. You know, don't worry about those things. The one modern horror that I really dug that we haven't talked about, did you see Get Out?

04:53:06.180 --> 04:53:06.280
out.

04:53:07.740 --> 04:53:08.400
No, I saw it.

04:53:08.610 --> 04:53:08.700
Okay.

04:53:09.340 --> 04:53:15.520
Jordan Peele, who was on like Key and Peele, which is completely like, it's like a sketch comedy show.

04:53:16.140 --> 04:53:18.080
And then all of a sudden he writes this horror film, Get Out.

04:53:18.110 --> 04:53:19.860
And it's actually, it's pretty decent.

04:53:20.080 --> 04:53:20.640
I like it.

04:53:21.042 --> 04:53:23.000
Actually, Mando, you need to go back one story.

04:53:23.070 --> 04:53:24.840
He wrote and starred in Keanu.

04:53:26.060 --> 04:53:26.700
Oh, gosh.

04:53:27.740 --> 04:53:28.120
Come on.

04:53:28.300 --> 04:53:29.140
How could you not bring up?

04:53:29.500 --> 04:53:29.680
Yes.

04:53:29.770 --> 04:53:31.160
I totally forgot that.

04:53:31.180 --> 04:53:34.780
If I didn't bring up Keanu, my better half would literally kick me out of the house.

04:53:34.920 --> 04:53:35.620
She loves that movie.

04:53:35.880 --> 04:54:05.180
Has anyone seen Keanu? Is it about a dog or something? No, it's about a cat. Yeah. Okay. Now, if you mark as I know you love cats, you need to go watch this. There's just one scene in this. Get that bitch. Do you remember that, Matt? Get that bitch. We still say that to our cat all the time. Okay. It's really funny, actually. I'll check it out. Yeah, it's a comedy. Is the cat able to talk? No. So long story short.

04:54:05.860 --> 04:54:34.140
You have to see it. I don't want to ruin it because the whole idea of this little cat becomes like the center of this whole movie. And it's him and his buddy who's been in a ton of stuff too. But they play multiple characters in the film. And somehow drugs get involved. There's a cat involved. And it just deescalates really fast. But it's fun to watch. It's silly but fun. You'll enjoy it. And if you like cats, you'll enjoy it. Is he named after Keanu Reeves?

04:54:35.560 --> 04:55:03.820
I don't know but the cat's called Keanu. Yeah interesting. Yeah I thought the same thing too. So yeah. Anybody likes really trashy movies like completely trash movies like. Oh yeah. Troll man I had never heard of that but yeah I like I like really like sea level movies. I feel like I've seen troll man. Does he come out of like. No no no I'm talking about that production company Troma. Oh. Oh.

04:55:05.540 --> 04:55:07.380
I don't know how to pronounce it but

04:55:07.520 --> 04:55:09.400
they did this wonderful

04:55:09.610 --> 04:55:10.860
movie The Toxic Avenger

04:55:11.170 --> 04:55:11.560
oh yeah

04:55:16.300 --> 04:55:17.380
I love that

04:55:18.820 --> 04:55:19.320
unfortunately

04:55:19.470 --> 04:55:21.200
I have to add this to one of

04:55:21.440 --> 04:55:23.120
the favorite film list

04:55:24.760 --> 04:55:26.040
it's so fun

04:55:26.560 --> 04:55:26.700
totally

04:55:28.420 --> 04:55:29.320
we watch

04:55:29.750 --> 04:55:30.400
a lot of those

04:55:32.202 --> 04:55:33.340
I like those

04:55:33.870 --> 04:55:35.520
super cheap horror movies

04:55:35.540 --> 04:56:05.220
I don't know. Try a movie. I love this movie. My wife loves it too called Black Sheep. It's not the one, the comedy. The one where they turn the sheep. You've seen it. It's freaking great. It's so good. It's from New Zealand. I'm a soccer player in Germany who looks like one of those sheep. Oh, really? A little bit and we always, oh, the sheep is on TV and yeah. Common sports now, but whatever. But yeah, I like movies like that.

04:56:05.520 --> 04:56:35.180
Have you seen Dead Snow? No, I don't think so. It's kind of a wacky, I can't remember where it's said. It might be Norway. I can't remember now. But it's a zombie movie where Nazi soldiers arise. And it's absolutely freaking ridiculous. And there's the second one too, Dead Snow 2, which is even more ridiculous. Oh, nice. So you would like those, I think, Hannes.

04:56:35.180 --> 04:57:05.160
That makes me think of the film with the Nazis where they go to the moon and they hide and waiting for like 50 years and they come back. That's a good one too. And I can't remember what it was called, but it was way over the top like that too. It's called Iron Sky. Yes. Yes. Yes. So you like that. You're going to like Dead Snow. I have not seen Iron Sky. I've heard the story. I think like it's intriguing, but I didn't make it long. I'm afraid to watch it.

04:57:05.200 --> 04:57:31.680
it's like whiplash. I'm just, I don't want to watch it. Because I'm kind of sure I will not like it for some reason. Because here's the thing, when Machete came out and everybody was like, this movie is so over the top, so ridiculous. And I knew Toxic Adventure already. I was really disappointed. Because actually compared to Toxic Adventure, it's kind of believable.

04:57:36.960 --> 04:58:05.160
So it's not over the top at all. And with that Iron Sky thing, it sets Nazis living on the dark side of the moon and coming with spaceships. I like the idea, but I'm skeptical if they really played it out well. I'm not sure. I have some reservations. Yeah, there's only so much you can do with that story. I know I will have to watch it at some point. Maybe. I hope I'm wrong. And none of my

04:58:05.600 --> 04:58:34.040
Yeah. Fear has become true. But it's with Whiplash. That movie came out, you know, the drummer movie. Yeah. Jazz drumming. And I love jazz drumming. I actually got recently, like during the pandemic, I got back into jazz drumming on, you know, just doing something else because all these shows didn't happen. And but then at some point, OK, this movie is out five years now. And I. I always thought, like,

04:58:36.940 --> 04:59:05.160
I'm probably not gonna like it and but I could not pinpoint why and I thought like okay now is the time I have to watch Whiplash and well the drumming is great and I hated the movie it's well done the actors are amazing the drumming is amazing but I hate everything about it it's this this it's based on the idea that everything in life is a huge competition

04:59:05.200 --> 04:59:35.160
especially music and you have to achieve greatness and greatness at any level and become you know this immortal guy and the teacher guy he's abusing also sometimes physically but also mentally abusing um his students and they even like a suggesting that he might have driven that former student into suicide by psycho terror and then at a certain point he you know get gets

04:59:35.180 --> 05:00:05.160
Gets ditched by the university and at the end at the final scene when you see like his former drum student become achieve this level of greatness become some great drummer then they justify all these actions they justify all the things all the abuse all the mental all the bullshit and it's like this this big I don't know almost iron rent kind of thing you have to achieve greatness to you know I don't buy that I don't like it I think it's it's yeah

05:00:06.000 --> 05:00:35.160
at some point he even has like a car accident and comes out bleeding and he still goes on there and plays his thing and think like this is bullshit well what's the point i mean what are you trying to say um the message is wrong it's going to be okay he's sacrificing everything in life for something that doesn't work out but in the end it worked out and was it was worth all of that and it was worth the abuse and it was worth all that because you can now play

05:00:35.160 --> 05:01:05.140
these jazz jobs. And I think this is completely stupid. So, list of worst films, probably that's my most hated movie. And that's why I have reservations against Iron Sky, because I thought, like, maybe they wanted it to be too much of a joke. Right. The only thing I'll say to that, Hannes, is that the way it plays out and the way that that character feels, because he's gone through that psychological trauma, he might actually feel that way in

05:01:05.180 --> 05:01:33.860
So as a movie, it doesn't work because the message is not a positive one. It's not a good message to reinforce. But in real life, that's something that people might go through. Yes, yes, but it's true. But then I also think like, but what the movie clearly says to me is if the goal can be reached, then the measures, they don't matter.

05:01:35.320 --> 05:02:03.020
That's really what they tell you. Like, no matter what you... The ends justify the means. The result counts. The result. And for greatness, there has to be made sacrifices or victims. Doesn't matter. As long as greatness is achieved. And I think that's... Yeah. I don't know. I think this is not because the message is not positive. Because the other day I watched Million Dollar Baby. Oh, I love that movie.

05:02:03.320 --> 05:02:30.480
Where I'm like, okay, it's like Rocky with a woman. No, it's not. She gets disabled and dies. What? It's like, oh, your big American dream is not turning out the way you wanted it to be. Well, that's probably the case for most people. This is closer to reality.

05:02:33.360 --> 05:03:03.300
is kind of it would be with any kind of thing it could be with bowling or no it doesn't have to be drumming drumming is just a vehicle to to insert some some of this um i don't know life training uh uh ideology i don't like it i i really think it's it's manipulating through this emotion um absolutely that is really well done by by the actors and like that the teacher

05:03:03.340 --> 05:03:33.300
guy's amazing as an actor I think as far as I have no idea about acting but I think it's really good and it sticks in your head but I think what they're selling is like a rotten fruit that's what I'm saying and I mean you can totally disagree with me on that but I was playing devil's advocate just yeah different ways to interpret

05:03:33.320 --> 05:04:03.200
I also say like this guy is a douche. He like ditched his girlfriend and then he went to all that just to play a couple of swing patterns like. Yeah, he was a douche. Yeah, he was. Yeah. So, you know. Well, should we should we wrap this up or do you want to keep talking about? No, we can. We can. Yeah, I've actually. This is great. Yeah. It was a movie heads podcast. So, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We really.

05:04:04.542 --> 05:04:33.140
We do what we want. Yeah, exactly. Hey, so do we want to get Hannes' Thunderdome? Jay's not coming, obviously. Yeah, but first, got to ask one question. Is there going to be new Trypticon? I think so. Okay. I mean, we're apart two countries because we rehearsed in Switzerland. So we really lost.

05:04:33.340 --> 05:05:02.560
this year because we couldn't get over the border. Or with the big hassle and then rehearsals. And yeah, it wasn't that easy. And so we really lost that year in doing nothing for that. But I don't see a reason why there shouldn't be new Trapticon stuff. I mean, I'm totally psyched for it. Yeah. Well, we would be too. So definitely. All right.

05:05:02.600 --> 05:05:32.560
So we're gonna do what three albums would help people get to know you better as a person, Hannes? I have to, I really thought about that and again I can maybe only name albums that I worked on. That works too. Because I thought about what as a person that would mean which album represents my person

05:05:32.620 --> 05:06:02.000
and that's very different from what represents my musical activity or me as a player or my, I don't know, mood or state of mind. Because I have a lot of things that I like that do not really represent my character or my, I don't know if that's even possible with music. Hard to tell. Because with other albums,

05:06:02.120 --> 05:06:32.100
I like a lot of stuff. But that doesn't mean that this had anything to do with the way I feel outside of that album. Right. So I don't know if it tells you something. Let's say if somebody likes this album by the Beatles, isn't that like a common denominator? Or does it really tell you something about that person? I don't know. I guess it depends on how that album would have affected the person. If it had something seminal in their life, do they identify what

05:06:32.140 --> 05:07:02.100
that album some part of it but yeah but it works too on albums that you worked on because clearly you put everything into those albums yeah well and i have to say of course uh the necrophages album abitaph because it opened all the doors for me musically and and you know yeah i played on that album and then i joined obscura the band was not signed but two guys of necrophages were in the band so we got a deal and then everything else i really think that is really i was very young this was my first professional recording i

05:07:02.100 --> 05:07:32.080
I worked my ass off to make it happen and that's really something that was like a game changer for me. So that's an important album for me. I have to say for me as a musician everything I like and everything that I always wanted to do and didn't have the means to do it I would say that all comes together in Liquid Anatomy by Alkaloid. At some point

05:07:32.120 --> 05:08:02.080
I just feel that way. I don't know. I did not write everything on that album, but it doesn't matter because the whole thing somehow is, yeah, that's the album I really wanted to do, always. But yeah, it's always just a step towards that so far. And maybe then some other album I do will change the perspective or that thing I want to do as a musician. Just

05:08:02.120 --> 05:08:32.080
changes and has different shapes but right now I have to say like from being a 14 year old kid listening to Rush or Iron Maiden and have like these epic albums and you know all of that and all the different influences from super brutal death metal to yes and I don't know Tori Angles it's everything in there right so that's really like yeah fantastic one album I would say and let's say

05:08:37.380 --> 05:09:01.960
The Downton Abbey soundtrack. Yes. It would be interesting. You know Hannes is going to listen to that right after this. Yeah, I will. Yeah. It's not bad. It's okay. Yeah. The intro melody, I always liked it, though. Yeah. Some good soundscapes.

05:09:02.120 --> 05:09:32.000
I like it. Yeah, exactly. What else? Third album, because it has to have the number three. I have to say at some, well, from my own albums, I would say then the most important one to understand what I'm doing. I have to say this is split decision between Omnivium by Obscura and my first solo record, I would say.

05:09:32.120 --> 05:10:01.820
Probably I'm tending towards Omnivium because it was more important in my personal development. And this was a time where we're on tour constantly and somehow I... This is where I kind of managed to create a style in some sense where I thought like, okay, this is shaping up as something that is not relating to all the material I listen to. This is like a culmination of music.

05:10:02.120 --> 05:10:31.760
I ingested through various channels up to this point. So, and that, that I would say, so I would say these three albums. So is that like the album you feel like you became the drummer that you wanted to be? Not necessarily the drummer. As a drummer, I mean, the parts on Epitaph are way more crazy, I would say. Some of them, at least. But it's not really my personality, the way I play on Epitaph. It's influenced me.

05:10:31.840 --> 05:11:01.780
But it's who I am now would have not been able without that album. So that's connected, yeah. So that's why I would always name Epidef as a one key album. Then probably Omnivium too, because it did the same way but with my own compositions. But again, I played on many albums and they were all important at some kind.

05:11:03.798 --> 05:11:31.800
on some kind of level, because you learn and develop new styles step by step. But I see these three have been really milestones on what am I doing in general as a musician. And of course you cannot take that away from my personality. These days we're talking a lot about identity and identity politics and all of that. And as much as I'm open to these ideas, it kind of creeps me out, because you

05:11:31.820 --> 05:12:01.800
taking a random thing and make that your identity and I think like first of all I'm a musician and then all the other stuff right you know or many many things and musician is definitely and what I do every day is really really more important to me than any any gender or race thing that I'm involved but I'm it's easy to say for me in my position but still that sometimes it creeps me out that we talk a

05:12:01.840 --> 05:12:31.800
I think a lot about identities when there's multiple identities and we don't accept the real diversity as humans and frame it to one set thing that's obvious that you either see or can relate to it in a group. Not saying I'm against any of that by, you know. Right. But it's just, I think, I would say my

05:12:33.422 --> 05:13:01.300
When the sentence, you cannot exclude my identity from how I am, who I feel, or whatever, then I would say, first of all, you cannot take... I'm never not a musician. I'm always a musician. And this is not just some mental thing. Even when I'm going hiking in the Himalayas, I'm still a musician doing that. And you might look at the mountains, and then I'm like... There's a pattern going on.

05:13:01.820 --> 05:13:05.560
I can never shut this off. I can never turn it off.

05:13:07.100 --> 05:13:09.640
And this is also, yeah, this is a thing.

05:13:09.880 --> 05:13:15.820
It's again saying that song, you know, that's why I understand on the other hand,

05:13:16.340 --> 05:13:23.980
some of the discussions there because, you know, black person, they can never change their appearance.

05:13:24.480 --> 05:13:27.600
They can never change. They're always like that. I'm always a musician.

05:13:30.240 --> 05:13:57.560
But that's really part of my identity. So I cannot deduct the music I do from who I am. If that makes any sense at all. It does, yeah. It does. Yeah. And I think with the gender discussion, I think it's more about raising awareness and acceptance for all the different types that are out there, you know? Yes. Yeah, that's great. Always a musician. I feel that same way. I'm always a writer.

05:13:57.640 --> 05:14:27.520
I can't turn it off. I'm always going to have ideas for stories constantly wherever I am. I had ideas for stories just talking to you. So yeah, cool. Great. So do you want to do the Thunderdome then, John? Like get Hannes' take? I mean, how do, since Jay's not here to explain it, do we want to just get Hannes' your opinion on these albums? You know, we could do all ours with the rest of the guys. I mean, it's up to you. Maybe if you're not mad at me, I would like to wrap this up.

05:14:28.060 --> 05:14:57.600
Yeah, let's do that. We can wrap it up and let you go because we've kept you for a long time. So I think it's Hannes's fault. He wanted to talk about all the television. I was like, I'm in. That's totally on Hannes. Yeah. Yeah. So what is your opinion on these two albums? Which is Iron Maiden, Seven Son of the Seven Son and Queensryche's Rage for Order. I have to say with Queen, let's start with Queensryche because they did

05:14:57.640 --> 05:15:26.738
not how do you say it's right yeah queen's right okay um i don't know if you have seen on it's on youtube the joe tate um digital um what is it like his digital card or something like that it's a video about which he recorded and produced i think it's on his channel but you can find it i have to look it up and send it to you guys you will laugh your ass off putting this out first okay

05:15:28.120 --> 05:15:33.640
It starts with, you know, Geoff Tate being Geoff Tate and talking about Geoff Tate.

05:15:34.240 --> 05:15:41.080
And the great thing here is it starts like, my name is Geoff Tate.

05:15:42.120 --> 05:15:45.300
I'm a writer, father, traveler.

05:15:46.440 --> 05:15:49.540
Yeah, I love my life.

05:15:51.500 --> 05:15:52.620
Sounds fantastic.

05:15:52.620 --> 05:16:21.240
And you see him ride a motorcycle and drinking wines. I'm enjoying traveling. I'm enjoying good wine once in a while. And stuff like that. It's fucking ridiculous. And so I have to say with the thing is with Queen's Drag, this doesn't, it's always in my head when I listen to Queen's Drag. And this is such a shame because he's such a great singer. Oh, yeah. Apparently he's a complete idiot. Happens.

05:16:22.240 --> 05:16:22.560
Yes.

05:16:23.080 --> 05:16:45.340
But we have to, this is something in general, we have to separate the persons that make the music and the music itself. And the music itself is good. It's a really, I would say, a good hard rock album. I have to say, maybe, maybe I like, what was the previous album, Operation Mindcrime? I kind of like this one a little better.

05:16:45.840 --> 05:16:46.700
Yeah, that one came afterwards.

05:16:47.900 --> 05:16:48.020
Yeah.

05:16:48.340 --> 05:16:48.960
Operation Mindcrime.

05:16:50.260 --> 05:16:51.020
It came afterwards.

05:16:51.460 --> 05:16:51.580
Yeah.

05:16:51.820 --> 05:17:21.560
Yeah. Okay. You know, yeah, that's here's the thing. I have a blind spot when it comes to to Queensryche because I'm not super familiar. I really like the first EP really. Oh, yeah. First EP is great. Yeah. Yeah, it's great. And I mean, yeah, the vocals are awesome. The arrangements are awesome. Sound is really good. And for me, I would say it's it's a good hard rock album.

05:17:23.700 --> 05:17:51.780
For me it's almost not really metal, I have to say. Whereas as Iron Maiden, this is for me hard to compare these albums. How can you compare so different albums? Because Iron Maiden was really a very important band for me. And especially the 80s records and especially Seven Son of the Seven Son. I love this record. At first it was one of these records where I, at first, the first albums I bought were

05:17:51.820 --> 05:18:19.560
of the beast, piece of mind, power slave. Yeah. And back then I had to go to a store and they didn't have all the albums. I picked the next one they had, which was seven sun and no, it was fear of the dark. That one I liked too, but not as much as the other eighties records, but I still liked it. And then seven sun, I listened to that and that was like a keyboard album. And that's not one of the one what I wanted to hear at all. Like, right.

05:18:24.700 --> 05:18:47.000
I expected the same stuff. Then, you know, again, I'm like, no, I don't like this. This is not good. No, no, I'm not buying this. Next day went back and like, I don't know, listen to it again. I didn't know. It's got something. And then listening to it a third time, like, oh my God, it's the best album ever done.

05:18:50.860 --> 05:19:20.840
That's how they get you. But I think those albums are the most rewarding albums. It's challenging to get into it because they crash your expectation. But you get something different. Once you accept that it's different, it can be great. And that's exactly the case. I think it has great material. I have to say, still, I would say I like Somewhere in Time, which is the other keyboard album. I like that better. I think it

05:19:21.080 --> 05:19:50.820
Even has better songs, but I don't know. Seven Sun is maybe one of the best songs, in my opinion. It's a good one. Yeah, the whole vibe is like, I don't know, it was recorded in Antarctica. I don't know. It's fascinating. So for me, maybe I can even say that Seven Sun definitely is in my top 20 or something. And Rage for Order is a great record to listen to once in a while.

05:19:50.880 --> 05:19:58.700
But yeah, it's not maybe not so much my cup of tea. So it's a really unfair comparison, I would say.

05:19:59.320 --> 05:20:20.680
Right. I mean, that's the whole point of the exercise is we picked these albums that you might not think of putting together. And we were hoping to get Jay's idea for it. I think we think we know what it is. But nonetheless, I think it's interesting because there are two keyboard driven albums for that time for hard rock metal playing.

05:20:20.780 --> 05:20:50.140
And that kind of music was not common. That was new. Oh, two albums where they go into very progressive territory for both of those bands, I think. It was the first concept album for Maiden, too, I think. Yes, but there was Turbo. Yeah. We don't talk about that album. See how we got real quiet there, Hannes? Actually, I kind of like Turbo. It's okay. Yeah, the neck is getting tight.

05:20:53.202 --> 05:21:20.560
Oh, yeah. So we've come to the end of the cast then, I guess. Yes. Yeah. On that note. Oh, this has been great. We appreciate you taking the time. We really appreciate it. We appreciate both the music and the television and movie views and likes and dislikes. We enjoyed all that. So thank you for taking time to spend with us. We know it's late on your end. So we appreciate that.

05:21:20.780 --> 05:21:49.660
Sure. And we love all your music. Can't wait for all the new projects. And while we only spent a few seconds on New Alkaloid and Trypticon, those few seconds will be the light on the mountain that we look towards in the future. Okay. We'll be excited for those. Thank you very much for that. I won't disappoint you. No, thank you. So we have one thing we wouldn't mind asking. If you wouldn't mind doing for us, would you mind doing a bumper for us for the podcast?

05:21:50.760 --> 05:22:20.740
which would be just you saying this is hannes grossman and you're listening to the metalheads podcast okay i think i can do that um okay do we need uh like a countdown or something we can't we can do a countdown trump

05:22:20.780 --> 05:22:50.740
I can't drop okay and action what am I supposed to say again your name I'm Hannes Grossman and you're listening I am and I am sounds like he man so no you can do that this is way better this is yeah okay and action this is Hannes Grossman and you're listening to the metal hats podcast

05:22:50.800 --> 05:23:20.620
Now, can you do it in a Kiefer Sutherland growly whisper? I can. You're going to do it, I'm in. The Sonus, you're listening to the Madlux podcast. That was epic. That is epic. Also, I love the close-up. That was fantastic. Listen on your Blackberry. Patch it through to your Blackberry. You're doing it really well. We're out of time. Yes, like that.

05:23:21.580 --> 05:23:22.760
We're out of time.

05:23:23.940 --> 05:23:24.960
That's really good.

05:23:25.360 --> 05:23:27.120
You can open up any time.

05:23:28.700 --> 05:23:33.500
So we're hoping that you go back and watch 24 so you can see why we're joking so much about this.

05:23:34.020 --> 05:23:34.540
I will.

05:23:34.700 --> 05:23:34.980
I will.

05:23:35.100 --> 05:23:37.540
Anyway, thank you again for taking the time.

05:23:37.580 --> 05:23:38.300
We appreciate it.

05:23:38.420 --> 05:23:39.040
Thank you, Hannes.

05:23:39.160 --> 05:23:40.300
Thank you for having me.

05:23:40.780 --> 05:23:41.240
Thank you.

05:23:42.220 --> 05:23:42.700
Thank you.

05:23:42.780 --> 05:23:44.060
Thank you for having me.

05:23:44.240 --> 05:23:46.880
And yes, have a good week.

05:23:47.440 --> 05:23:47.760
You too.

05:23:47.860 --> 05:23:48.220
You as well.

05:23:48.460 --> 05:23:48.920
Thanks, Hannes.

05:23:48.960 --> 05:23:49.260
Take care.

05:23:49.840 --> 05:23:50.240
Bye-bye.

05:23:50.520 --> 05:23:50.640
Bye.

05:24:32.000 --> 05:24:50.400
Metal Heads Podcast. I just want to say you are by far my favorite podcast and I don't even like metal. And it's because of episodes like this last one with Justin and the ones previous with artists, record shop owners, etc. that you elevate.

05:24:51.120 --> 05:25:03.920
Beyond Review Show, and you have turned into just a great interview show. Well done. Love the last episode. You guys are great. Keep it up.